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TOV Forums > Professional Motorsports > > Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Spoilers

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gofast182
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-15-2019 10:16
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From what we see so far things are pretty much where I thought they'd be with our teams. I hope RBR is holding a little bit back for quali. and on the STR side that ALB can run closer to KVY.

In general Ferrari powered teams aren't producing like I thought they would. Hopefully they, too, have something held back so we aren't looking at another year of full Merc. domination up front and Haas falling behind on their progress.

Bullwinkle
Profile for Bullwinkle
Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-15-2019 11:49
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gofast182 wrote:
That nonsense about McLaren's chassis was insidious propaganda to save face with their sponsors at the expense of Honda.


My compliments on excellent use of insidious! That word is insidiously underused, in my opinion, of course.

I don't necessarily agree with that being the cause of McLaren's tirades against Honda. I know a little something about the McLaren culture, and what stands out to me is how much arrogant confidence pervades.

I think they were delusional and believed their chassis was better than it was -- until they put a Renault engine in it. I think they actually believed that their chassis with a Renault PU would put them up with Red Bull on the time sheets.

My contacts indicate that once the 2018 season started, much of the confidence about the performance of their vaunted chassis disappeared. The reality of Red Bull and Renault were able to do with that PU settled in pretty quickly.

Honda was just a convenient scapegoat.

It will be interesting to see what they do with Alonso at the Indy 500. They are going into this with the same equipment that Team Penske has (Dallara-Chevy), and they probably actually believe that they will be able to beat Team Penske at a race that Penske has won umpteen times.

It's interesting to think about the two organizations, Penske and McLaren. I have had significant dealings with Penske, and that organization is just as confident in its abilities as McLaren, but I have not seen the arrogance in Penske.

I think this is because everyone in the organization challenges every assumptions. And when they do not win, the set about to challenge their own practices to figure out why, rather than blaming partners.

Potenza
Profile for Potenza
Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-15-2019 12:08
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gofast182 wrote:
From what we see so far things are pretty much where I thought they'd be with our teams. I hope RBR is holding a little bit back for quali. and on the STR side that ALB can run closer to KVY.

In general Ferrari powered teams aren't producing like I thought they would. Hopefully they, too, have something held back so we aren't looking at another year of full Merc. domination up front and Haas falling behind on their progress.

I haven't watched any track action, but I've been hearing that the Merc looks like a bit of a handful to drive.

Horner says that VER had some traffic on his fast laps, so there is more potential there. And the Toro Rosso race engineer has stated that the tyres donít perform as well after the first timed lap. So overall we have to keep in mind that, as far as posted fast laps, those times are never achieved during the race. While a one-lap pace is good for qualifying position, it has little to do with the race itself.

So my anticipation comes from the memories of races where we've seen VER reeling in HAM - and passing - on pure pace. If he could do that with Renault power, I look forward to seeing what "the best and most expensive car in the history of Red Bull Racing," powered by Honda, can do.

HondaJet
Profile for HondaJet
Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-15-2019 12:26
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Honda Dream wrote:
Looking at the FP you can only say how important the rest of the car is... you can only imagine what would be if Honda was allowed to supply RB in 2016(?), but was not by Ron Dennis. Even though Honda did not produce the best or even 2nd best engine this year RB-H looks quite ok, which makes me say how bad McLaren have been for the last a couple of years and that they were very very responsible for miserable results of Mc-H in 2015-17. Williams fighting McLaren at the bottom, where are 1980s,90s,2000s years... so where is this best chassis of McL? Mr.Alonso, where is this something you McLarens can finally fight with?
Do you still believe McLaren did have the right to throw Honda under the bus for miserable results? Well the picture says a lot now. Honda was made responsible for the results like it would be the PU to be responsible in 90% for performance. It is not.
However it is McLaren who deserves massive criticism now, for blaming others for their own failures. Honda was brave enough to acknowledge not not have produced the good enough engine. McLaren produced a bad car and said they had one of the best...


I agree 100%

gofast182
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-15-2019 12:45
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Bullwinkle wrote:
gofast182 wrote:
That nonsense about McLaren's chassis was insidious propaganda to save face with their sponsors at the expense of Honda.


My compliments on excellent use of insidious! That word is insidiously underused, in my opinion, of course.

I don't necessarily agree with that being the cause of McLaren's tirades against Honda. I know a little something about the McLaren culture, and what stands out to me is how much arrogant confidence pervades.

I think they were delusional and believed their chassis was better than it was -- until they put a Renault engine in it. I think they actually believed that their chassis with a Renault PU would put them up with Red Bull on the time sheets.

My contacts indicate that once the 2018 season started, much of the confidence about the performance of their vaunted chassis disappeared. The reality of Red Bull and Renault were able to do with that PU settled in pretty quickly.

Honda was just a convenient scapegoat.

It will be interesting to see what they do with Alonso at the Indy 500. They are going into this with the same equipment that Team Penske has (Dallara-Chevy), and they probably actually believe that they will be able to beat Team Penske at a race that Penske has won umpteen times.

It's interesting to think about the two organizations, Penske and McLaren. I have had significant dealings with Penske, and that organization is just as confident in its abilities as McLaren, but I have not seen the arrogance in Penske.

I think this is because everyone in the organization challenges every assumptions. And when they do not win, the set about to challenge their own practices to figure out why, rather than blaming partners.


I'm sure you're right about the root cause. The effect, to people who had an idea of what was *really* going on at the time, was propaganda.

I can't wait to hear your predictions/analysis for the 500 but that's a different thread and we should probably let a few races go by...

rogazilla
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-15-2019 14:58
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All being said and watched both FP1/2. Merc seems to jump around a bit as many have mentioned that it seems to have a stiff suspension but I don't equate that to the twitchy rear end as many have said. It is fast though based on time we have so far.

Red bull wise lost the last 2 days of test session to do race sims or qualy run and looks like they were doing testing in both sessions. interesting note is that Max did 6 or 7 laps after setting his fastest lap. That means there are more pace in the car than his fastest lap indicates. How much? anyone's guesses.

Gasly looks pretty level headed and maybe he will be more cautious due to the 2 accidents he had.

Looking forward to see what Kvyat can do in the TR.

I see gasly crashing in testing and Albon spinning out a good thing really, granted crashing the car is not idea since parts are limited but if they don't crash it or spin it, they are not trying hard enough :)


bigblue
Profile for bigblue
Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-15-2019 17:42
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Birthday boy with his cake (picture shamelessly plundered from a muramasa post on autosport forums : "Yamamoto 55th birthday today. Birthday gift for Yamamoto from Tost: Albon's rear wing endplate that was damaged by crash in FP1").


sadlerau
Profile for sadlerau
Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-15-2019 19:37
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It seems Verstappen is getting a new tub today? Forum gossip says he was using the tub they used in pre-season testing, and now needs replacing, reason not divulged yet.
tom3690
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-16-2019 02:21
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Gasly our in Q1 !
tom3690
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-16-2019 02:32
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Out
tom3690
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-16-2019 03:02
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4th. Really good result. Mercs are outrageously fast !! Look edgy as helll even in a straight line but tons of grip
towncaptain
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-16-2019 03:07
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I'm not sure if Gasly went out again in the last 5 mins. Redbull thinking he was safe to advance to Q2. Can someone confirm?
MarkR
Profile for MarkR
Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-16-2019 03:27
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Bullwinkle wrote:
gofast182 wrote:
That nonsense about McLaren's chassis was insidious propaganda to save face with their sponsors at the expense of Honda.


My compliments on excellent use of insidious! That word is insidiously underused, in my opinion, of course.

I don't necessarily agree with that being the cause of McLaren's tirades against Honda. I know a little something about the McLaren culture, and what stands out to me is how much arrogant confidence pervades.

I think they were delusional and believed their chassis was better than it was -- until they put a Renault engine in it. I think they actually believed that their chassis with a Renault PU would put them up with Red Bull on the time sheets.

My contacts indicate that once the 2018 season started, much of the confidence about the performance of their vaunted chassis disappeared. The reality of Red Bull and Renault were able to do with that PU settled in pretty quickly.

Honda was just a convenient scapegoat.

It will be interesting to see what they do with Alonso at the Indy 500. They are going into this with the same equipment that Team Penske has (Dallara-Chevy), and they probably actually believe that they will be able to beat Team Penske at a race that Penske has won umpteen times.

It's interesting to think about the two organizations, Penske and McLaren. I have had significant dealings with Penske, and that organization is just as confident in its abilities as McLaren, but I have not seen the arrogance in Penske.

I think this is because everyone in the organization challenges every assumptions. And when they do not win, the set about to challenge their own practices to figure out why, rather than blaming partners.




...and all is pure speculation and just guessing. It's like statistics, you can turn it any way you want, use statistics to prove your point if you want.

Seems like Max with Honda didn't really push today, since they are far off and Lando Norris just blipped the throttle and the Toro Rossos were left far behind...

I heard from the paddock the the Honda engine is super strong but they didn't turn up the wick since the chassies is so strong... they should have.

No seriously, let's enjoy the season it will be a great season.

I think McLaren will bouce back to a regular top10 team, RB will be a regular top 6 team and Merc will be winning once again.

but I'm just speculating like everyone else.

danielgr
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-16-2019 05:00
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towncaptain wrote:
I'm not sure if Gasly went out again in the last 5 mins. Redbull thinking he was safe to advance to Q2. Can someone confirm?

That's what their PR said.
For sure he didn't go out and, before the final charge, he looked to be comfortably into Q2.

Summing up, I think the tab blew it up big time.
And yet that gives him his first ever chance to go out there in true overtaking mode. Should be fun.

sennaFAN
Profile for sennaFAN
Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-16-2019 06:47
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Max did pretty much everything he could to gain 4th. I only hope that the Merc's one lap pace is at the expense of their race pace and more importantly their rear tyre use.
Ferrari must be absolutely furious that they have been duped so badly by Merc. They were clearly sandbagging like mad in Barcelona.
It's a shame in a way that they are so far ahead as a three way fight would have been a lot of fun, but time will tell I guess. Also Melbourne is notorious for giving misleading impressions of true pace over the whole season so fingers crossed.
The Honda PU seems to be working pretty well and very reliably so far too.
Interesting to see the STR rookie getting the better of Kvyat after he seemed to be struggling by comparison through the free practice and Q1. I like this guy ..
Congrats to Norris too. I know it is fashionable to hate on Mclaren but F1 desperately needs the independents to succeed for the good of the sport going forward. By stark contrast it breaks my heart to see Williams in such an appalling state. I really hope they get some pace very soon

400K
Profile for 400K
Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-16-2019 08:14
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I love this guy (Kubica: I made an error because I had more grip)
https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.sudden-improvement-in-grip-led-to-kubica's-brush-with-wall-in-qualifying.1qQKx9J07H1eIp1bTC0rT5.html

I hope Gasly to come in 6th place from last.

Dren
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-16-2019 08:55
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Looks like Renault still has a faster customer team than them. I was hoping for a bit more from STR, but they finished about where I expected. Promising that RB are close to Ferrari...not so promising that Mercedes is so far ahead of the rest.
sadlerau
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-16-2019 09:31
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Was out all day and just caught up......

Mercedes looks unstable in a straight line due to very stiff compliance, yet its working OK over the lap. Keep in mind Melbourne is a very bumpy track. But stiffer suspension usually means higher tyre wear.

Have they made the Ferrari too benign? It looked so hooked up on the in-car shots have they left too much "on the table"?

My, my Red Bull are struggling. I know Verstappen likes to leave nothing in reserve out on track, but he seemed to need to seriously overdrive it to generate lap times. Is the Honda down on power? Has Newey fluffed it for a change?

Bring on the race......

danielgr
Profile for danielgr
Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-16-2019 10:24
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Dren wrote:
Looks like Renault still has a faster customer team than them. I was hoping for a bit more from STR, but they finished about where I expected. Promising that RB are close to Ferrari...not so promising that Mercedes is so far ahead of the rest.

The curious part is that, if you guys go and check past year's qualy, it's pretty much an identical situation this year.

And yet during the season Ferrari ended up challenging the Macs, so it does seem that the later are always better here. That has at least been the pattern in the past.

Potenza
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-16-2019 12:23
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sadlerau wrote:
Is the Honda down on power? Has Newey fluffed it for a change?

Bring on the race......

Well we already knew the former was going to be true, compared to Merc and Ferrari. Five Ferrari-powered cars in the top 9.

Comparing best qualifying lap times to last year, Toro Rosso lowered its time by 1.62%. Red Bull only lowered its time by 0.46%. (Merc lower by 0.56%, Ferrari lower by 0.52%).

As someone on reddit noted, Vettel's faster lap this year - 0.64s faster - wouldn't have even beat HAM's 2018 lap! Yet HAM got a further 0.68s faster on top of that now.

Potenza
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-16-2019 12:41
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towncaptain wrote:
I'm not sure if Gasly went out again in the last 5 mins. Redbull thinking he was safe to advance to Q2. Can someone confirm?
The plan was to get through Q1 using only one set of tyres, with a fast lap, a cool-down lap to recharge the battery, and a second fast lap.

However, circumstances led to Gasly doing two cool-down laps, and then subsequently his second fast lap was not quicker than the first.

"Pierre didn't manage to improve, as Max did by two and a half tenths, and the circuit in the meantime ramped up with obviously other teams taking second sets of tyres.

"After he completed his second flying lap, he had missed the cut-off of getting in, getting a set of tyres, and getting out again."


1. Strategy issue - wanting to use just one set of soft tires
2. Dash/battery-recharge issue, requiring 2 cool down laps instead of 1
3. Gasly's failure to improve on his time for the 2nd fast lap

bigblue
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-16-2019 16:31
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Is it because of the off-season and forgetting, or has the way the coverage is produced changed, or is it the confines of Mebourne, but the cars look really fast from onboard. That Merc looks a bit of a handful, but it seems to be effective. Damn !
Potenza
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-16-2019 17:15
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It seems Hamilton has 8 poles here but just 2 wins. Like last year, when Vettel won despite having an equivalently slower quali time.

Further, everyone seems to agree that Australia is an outlier track. So while it's a race that counts, it's not necessarily a harbinger to the entire season.


Remember last year when VER scored more points than HAM through the last few races of the season? I think the chance for VER to fight for the championship lies in having multiple winners. HAM take a few, VET take a few, BOT a couple, LEC a couple, and VER a couple. If the points are spread out, our top Honda man could have a chance.

Much like Marquez at Qatar, the key for VER will be to maximize points at the tracks that don't suit his ride. If VER gets a podium here, that's a victory, the way I see it.

Grace141
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Spoilers    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-17-2019 02:01
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How freaking sweet it is! I just watched a Honda pass a Ferrari and now closing the gap on a Mercedes.
400K
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Spoilers    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-17-2019 02:44
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Same feeling! Maybe the fastest off all.
sadlerau
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Spoilers    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-17-2019 03:06
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DRS would have helped, but yes not lacking too much in the PU department.

Congratulations to the Honda bofins, they just took the first step in eradicating demons of recent seasons.

Grace141
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Spoilers    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-17-2019 03:14
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So it was obvious the Honda PU is down on power to the Mercedes but Verstappen was able to draw up on Hamilton only to see the gap then be stable or drop back a tenth or two. Verstappen did end up with a bit of a tire advantage but he had to be close for it to matter. I wonder if Honda still has some power left on the table.

My Drive of the Day must go to Bottas. I thought Raikkonen had a strong drive.

danielgr
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Spoilers    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-17-2019 03:16
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Grace141 wrote:
How freaking sweet it is! I just watched a Honda pass a Ferrari and now closing the gap on a Mercedes.

Botas was fastest, but Redbull hasn't been this close to P1 in Australia for quite a while 😊.

Such a great feeling, was getting ready for the engine to blow up any second but it didn't 😅

Midi_Amp
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Spoilers    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-17-2019 03:31
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Grace141 wrote:
So it was obvious the Honda PU is down on power to the Mercedes but Verstappen was able to draw up on Hamilton only to see the gap then be stable or drop back a tenth or two. Verstappen did end up with a bit of a tire advantage but he had to be close for it to matter. I wonder if Honda still has some power left on the table.

My Drive of the Day must go to Bottas. I thought Raikkonen had a strong drive.


I missed the race!

I'm probably going to ruin my pants watching the race recap, but my oh my... That Verstappen kid is really something. I don't know what kind of black magic Redbull pulled back then to have the foresight to sign him. If I'm not mistaken, changing engine is not that simple, as the driver also needs to adjust with new power band and shifting points.

Anyway, off to collect from my friends that bets Redbull Honda will end up DNF with engine and/or transmission issue.

sadlerau
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Re: F1 - 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Spoilers    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-17-2019 03:54
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danielgr wrote:
Such a great feeling, was getting ready for the engine to blow up any second but it didn't 😅


I didn't even dare to think about that! :)

I may have misheard, but Herr Evil said on the grid pre-race, that Red Bull had gone down a wrong development path leading up to Qualifying. Looking forward to finding out a bit more about that.


 
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