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  TOV News > American Honda Sets 3rd Straight Annual Sales Record with Best-Ever December > > Re: Year End Comparison #s

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TSX69
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Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-04-2018 12:33
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CLA 2,279 +21.5%
A3 1,754 -24.2%
2series 1,188 +9.5%
Regal 1,005 -23.2%
ILX 835 -19.6%
Bclass 111 +1-5.6%
Verano 53 -94.9%
CT 9 -99%

A3 20,733 -23.9%
CLA 20,669 -19.9%
ILX 11,757 -19.2%
Regal 11,559 -41.7%
2series 11,737 -24.4%
CT 4,690 -47.1%
Verano 4,277 -85.9%
Bclass 744 +17.7%

Cclass 6,500 -11.5%
Q50 5,583 -3.6%
3series 5,556 -17.6%
ES 5,047 -16%
A4 3,916 -2.3%
TLX 3,101 -11.1%
IS 2,777 -34.9%
MKZ 2,293 -13.5%
ATS 1,093 -52.3%
LaCrosse 1,005 -23.2%
S60 1,071 -47.8%
Giulia 1,011 +3,386%

Cclass 77,447 +.4%
3series 59,449 -15.6%
ES 51,298 -11.5%
Q50 40,739 -7.4%
TLX 34,846 -5.9%
A4 34,434 -.7%
MKZ 27,387 -10.3%
IS 26,482 -28.7%
LaCrosse 20,161 -26.9%
ATS 13,100 -39.1%
S60 12,142 -14.6%
XE 9,278
Giulia 8,903 +24,631%

Eclass 5,385 +11%
5series 4,743 +124.3%
A6 1,970 -2.3%
G80 1,542
XTS 1,224 -60.9%
Continental 1,216 -34.1%
GS 916 -28.2%
S90 818 -27.4%
CTS 805 -52.6%
Q70 406 -30%
RLX 186 +.6%; hybrid 69 +131.1%

Eclass 51,312 +.8%
5series 40,658 +25.5%
A6 16,304 -12.7%
XTS 16,275 -26.65%
G80 16,196
Continental 12,012 +128.3%
CTS 10,344 -35%
S90 8,640 +213.5%
GS 7,773 -47.6%
Q70 5,772 -1.7%
RLX 1,237 -16%; hybrid 292 +24.7%

Sclass 2,18 +46.2%
7series 1,107 -15.7%
CT6 841 -35%
Panamera 455
G90 406
LS 306 -47.8%
A8 266 -46.9%

Sclass 15,888 -15.5%
CT6 10,542 +15%
7series 9,276 -28.2%
Panamera 6,731
G90 4,398
LS 4,094 -25.5%
A8 3,127 -24.6%

4series 3,411 -6.1%
A5 2,958 +400.5%
Q60 869 -14.6%
RC 686 -31.6%
Boxster/Cayman 301
4C 26 +13%

4series 39,634 +10.8%
A5 21,301 +155%
Q60 10,751 +170.8%
RC 7,363 -33.8%
Boxster/Cayman 5,087
4c 407 -15%


911 773
AMG GT 183 +84.8%
i8 80 -40%
NSX 56 14.5%
R8 56 -31.7%

911 8,970
AMG GT 1,608 +31.1%
R8 772 +4.9%
NSX 581 +116.7%
i8 488 -69.4%


Encore 8,052 +3.8%
NX 7,410 +4.3%
X1 4,454 +6.4%
GLA 2,580 +9.7%
Q2 2,367 +15.6%
QX30 830 +12.2%

Encore 88,035 +12.1%
NX 59,341 +8.5%
X1 30,826 +10.8%
GLA 24,104 -1.8%
Q3 20,633 +2.9%
QX30 14,093 +523.9%

RX 13,951 -2.7%
Q5 7,531 +17.7%
XT5 6,888 -7.4%
GLC 6,152 +53.1%
Envision 6,056 +54.1%
RDX 4,808 -16%
X3 4,283 -14%
MKX 2,976 -15.6%
MKC 2,504 -10.4%
XC60 2,204
QX50 1,785 -11.95
Discovery Sport 1,466
Cayenne 940

RX 108,307 -.7%
XT5 68,312 +73%
Q5 57,640 +16.3%
RDX 51,295 -2%
GLC 48,642 +1.6%
Envision 41,040 +189.2%
X3 40,691 -7.9%
MKX 31,031 +.2%
MKC 27,048 +5.8%
F-Pace 18,946
QX50 16,857 -.7%
Cayenne 13,203
XC60 6,984

X5 6,847 +9.6%
MDX 6,076 +1.1%; hybrid 228
GLE 5,823 +4.5%
Enclave 5,326 +40.2%
Q7 4,838 +47.7%
XC90 4,771 +44.3%
QX60 4,098 -16.8%
GX 3,325 -.6%
Range Rover Velar 1,694
Range Rover Sport 1,452
Macan 1,444
Stelvio 997
QX70 292 -73.1%
MKT 186 -71.3%

MDX 54,886 -.8%; hybrid 1,807
GLE 54,595 +5.4%
X5 50,815 +6.7%
Enclave 48,564 -6.7%
QX60 40,444 -4%
Q7 38,346 +25.5%
XC90 40,996 -4.7%
GX 27,190 +8.5%
Macan 21,429
QX70 6,878 +9.9%
MKT 3,005 -25.4%
Stelvio 2,721

GLS 2,998 -8.1%
Escalade 2,881 -15%
QX80 2,516 -11.9%
Navigator 1,444 +30.1%
LX 744 -7.6%

GLS 32,248 +5.9%
Escalade 22,994 -2.6%
QX80 17,881 +6.6%
Navigator 10,523 +1%
LX 6,004 +5.5%


MB 337,246 -.9%
BMW 305,685 -2.4%
Lexus 305,132 -7.6%
Audi 226,511 +7.8%
Buick 219,231 -4.5%
Cadillac 156,4440 -8%
Acura 154,602 -3.9%
Infiniti 153,415 +10.9%
Lincoln 111,159 -.5%
Volvo 81,504 -1.5%
Land Rover 74,739
Porsche 44,420
Jaguar 39,594
Genesis 20,594
Alfa Romeo 12,031 +2,232%





Spark 3,079 -27.7%
Cooper 828 +1.8%
500 667 -53%
Smart 155 -86%

Spark 22,589 -36.4%
500 12,685 -18%
Cooper 7,724 -30.9%
Smart 3,071 -50.6%

Versa 7,125 -9.4%
Accent 5,205
Fiesta 3,657 -3%
Fit 3,434 -19.4%
Yaris 2,111 -20.5%
Sonic 1,946 -69.5%
Rio 1,618
Mirage 1,023
Golf 775 -58.6%

Versa 106,772 -19.2%
Accent 58,955
Fit 49,454 -12.4%
Fiesta 46,249 -5.2%
Yaris 44,280 +14.6%
Sonic 30,290 -45.2%
Mirage 22,386
Rio 16,760
Golf 13,552 -1.5%

Civic 31,406 +3.6%
Elantra 21,350
Corolla 19,969 -33.6%
Sentra 16,934 -1.2%
Cruze 13,406 -22.6%
Focus 11,237 +9.7%
Impreza 8,037 +56.8%
Forte 7,922
Jetta 7,233 -44.7%
3 5,669 -30%
Lancer 683
Dart 139 -91%

Civic 377,286 +3.2%
Corolla 308,695 -14.1%
Sentra 218,451 +1.7%
Elantra 198,210
Cruze 184,751 -2.2%
Focus 158,385 -6.2%
Forte 117,596
Jetta 115,808 -4.4%
Impreza 86,043 +55.8%
3 75,018 -21.5%
Lancer 12,725
Dart 10,082 -77%

Camry 43,331 +34.7%
Accord 22,115 -32.2%; hybrid 1,160 -61.4%
Altima 18,199 -26.5%
Fusion 17,444 -8.8%
Malibu 16,628 -27%
Sonata 13,146
Optima 7,081
Legacy 4,593 -22.9%
Passat 3,015 -58.4%
6 1,776 -51.8%
200 332 -87%

Camry 387,081 -.1%
Accord 322,655 -6.2%; hybrid 22,008 +140.5%
Altima 254,996 -17%
Fusion 209,623 -21.1%
Malibu 185,857 -18.4%
Sonata 131,803
Optima 107,493
Passat 60,722 -16.8%
Legacy 49,837 -23.7%
6 33,402 -26.6%
200 18,457 -68%

Impala 8,201 -24%
Charger 6,830 -6%
300 5,726 +60%
Maxima 5,016 -5.2%
Taurus 2,719 -8.8%
Avalon 2,427 -50.1%
Cadenza 896
Azera 141

Charger 88,351 -7%
Impala 75,877 -21.8%
Maxima 67,627 +7.9%
300 51,237 -4%
Taurus 33,242 -4%
Avalon 32,583 -32%
Cadenza 7,249
Azera 3,060

Mustang 7,714 +9.4%
Challenger 4,508 -14%
Camaro 3,802 -45.7%
Stinger 826
Miata 493 -32.7%
86 425 -20.8%
370z 304 -17.4%
BRZ 297 +38.8%
Spider 287 +15%

Mustang 81,866 -22.7%
Camaro 67,940 -6.6%
Challenger 64,537 0%
Miata 11,294 +19.3%
86 6,846 -7.9%
370z 4,614 -22%
Spider 4,478 +81%
BRZ 4,131 -.2%
Stinger 843

Prius 9,482 20.9%
Bolt 3,227 +457.3%
Niro 2,397
Volt 1,937 -47.5%
Clarity 1,425 +18,397.6%
CMAX 1,416 -35.2%
Ioniq 908
Mirai 296 +165%
LEAF 102 -94.6%
OutLander PHEV 99


Prius 108,662 20.2%
Niro 27,237
Bolt 23,297
Volt 20,349 -17.7%
CMAX 18,390 -7.3%
Ioniq 11,197
Clarity 2,455 +30,687.8%
Mirai 1,838 +78.3%
LEAF 11,230 -19.8%
OutLander PHEV 99

OutBack 18,248 -11.8%
Golf SportWagen 1,493 -55.2%

OutBack 188,886 +3.3%
Golf SportWagen 26,700 +71.6%

CrossTrek 12,302 +20.3%
Soul 7,610
HR-V 7,543 -13.3%
Renegade 7,542 -37%
Trax 6,563 -18%
C-HR 3,866
CX3 1,582 -3.9%
CountryMan 1,541 +80.7%
500x 673 -20%
Juke 245 -81%

Soul 115,712
CrossTrek 110,138 +15.1%
Renegade 103,434 -3%
HR-V 94,034 +15%
Trax 79,289 +.3%
C-HR 25,755
CX3 15,355 -11.9%
CountryMan 14,864 1+7%
Juke 10,157 -48.1%
500x 7,665 -35%

Rogue 40,172 -.8%
CR-V 36,983 +1.7%
Equinox 32,784 +20.6%
Rav4 32,542 -9.2%
Escape 26,253 +1.8%
Cherokee 19,538 +18%
Forester 17,441 -3.2%
CX5 14,097 +17.6%
Tucson 11,633
Compass 8,743 +10%
Terrain 6,500 -12.6%
Tiguan 5,770
Sportage 5,585
Journey 4,227 -57%
OutLander Sport 3,678
Patriot 240 -97%

Rav4 407,594 +16.1%
Rogue 403,465 +22.3%
CR-V 377,895 +6.1%
Escape 308,296 +.4%
Equinox 290,458 +19.9%
Forester 177,563 -.6%
Cherokee 169,882 -15%
CX5 127,563 +13.7%
Tucson 114,735
Journey 89,470 -16%
Terrain 85,441 -2.8%
Compass 83,253 -11%
Sportage 72,824
Patriot 40,735 -67%
OutLander Sport 33,160
Tiguan 21,023

Explorer 25,375 +33.3%
Grand Cherokee 23,662 +2%
HighLander 21,041 -14.1%
Pilot 18,602 +60%
Edge 13,660 +7.6%
SantaFe 13,146
Traverse 12,313 +18.6%
Acadia 10,837 -11.1%
Murano 9,718 +23.3%
Sorento 7,740
PathFinder 6,053 -35.4%
Durango 5,547 -4%
CX9 3,276 +26.3%
OutLander 3,018
Toureg 484 +22.2%

Grand Cherokee 240,696 +13%
Explorer 238,056 +10.1%
HighLander 215,775 +13.1%
Edge 142,603 +6%
SantaFe 133,171
Pilot 127,279 +5.7%
Traverse 123,506%
Acadia 111,276 +25.8%
Sorento 99,684
PathFinder 81,701 -.8%
Murano 76,732 -11.8%
Durango 68,761 0%
OutLander 35,310
CX9 25,828 +60.9%
Touareg 3,545 -16.1%

Pacifica 11,144 +8%
Sienna 8,941 -16.9%
Odyssey 8,874 -1.5%
Caravan 6,623 -1%
Flex 1,834 -40.6%
Sedona 1,329
Town & Country 6 -98%
Quest 1 -99.9%

Caravan 125,196 -2%
Pacifica 118,274 +90%
Sienna 111,489 -12.5%
Odyssey 100,307 -16.7%
Sedona 23,815
Flex 22,389 -1.2%
Quest 4,950 -55.5%
Town & Country 577 -99%

Tacoma 18,705 +10.9%
Colorado 9,626 +2.1%
Frontier 5,880 -3.1%
Canyon 3,467 -14.4%
RidgeLine 2,854 -27.4%

Tacoma 198,124 +3.7%
Colorado 112,996 +3.9%
Frontier 74,360 -14.5%
RidgeLine 34,749 +47.3%
Canyon 32,106 -14.3%

longhorn
Profile for longhorn
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-04-2018 12:38
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Thank you, thank you, thank you sir.
vh2k
Profile for vh2k
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-04-2018 12:49
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Rogue, RAV4, CRV, Grand Cherokee, Explorer, Highlander

Those numbers are astronomical!!!

CivicSi99
Profile for CivicSi99
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-04-2018 13:08
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Thanks!!!
MalcolmR
Profile for MalcolmR
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-04-2018 16:22
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.
Thank you, TSX69.

Much appreciated. Guides a lot of people.

Happy new year.

Malcolm

😄

HDNBenjamin
Profile for HDNBenjamin
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-04-2018 22:02
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Great job and much appreciation, TSX!
BallerMDX
Profile for BallerMDX
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-04-2018 23:08
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Thanx for the hard work TSX69.

With all the praise Lexus gets, shocking their sedans/coupe (with the exception of the Avalon-based ES) doing this badly, even by luxury car standards. It will be interesting to see how well the revamped LS and all new LC change this. I think Lexus hit the ball out of the universe with the interior design of the LC in particular. As for the LS, it's certainly not your grandpa's LS, but something about it just doesn't say premium/flagship to me. Can't put my finger on it.

sadlerau
Profile for sadlerau
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-05-2018 06:04
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TSX69's dedication and hard work is much appreciated!
MSZ
Profile for MSZ
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-05-2018 06:46
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BallerMDX wrote:
Thanx for the hard work TSX69.

With all the praise Lexus gets, shocking their sedans/coupe (with the exception of the Avalon-based ES) doing this badly, even by luxury car standards. It will be interesting to see how well the revamped LS and all new LC change this. I think Lexus hit the ball out of the universe with the interior design of the LC in particular. As for the LS, it's certainly not your grandpa's LS, but something about it just doesn't say premium/flagship to me. Can't put my finger on it.



The Lexus brand only gets praises on this forum. I have been saying this for years that most of the cars they sold in NA in the previous years were FWD based. No one buys their RWD cars. Outside of USA, Volvo outsold Lexus by a country mile worldwide.

gofast182
Profile for gofast182
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-05-2018 07:47
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Thank you, TSX69. Not only do I find the stats fascinating myself, I use your posts, even from years back, to get numbers for conversations with friends and forum posts.

Bullwinkle
Profile for Bullwinkle
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-05-2018 10:17
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vh2k wrote:
Rogue, RAV4, CRV, Grand Cherokee, Explorer, Highlander

Those numbers are astronomical!!!



The impressive thing is that the CR-V even got close to the Rogue and RAV4. I rented a car recently at an Airport National and i the place was littered with Rogues and RAV4s. When I drove back to the airport, one entire return line was nothing but Rogues. I counted 15 nose-to-tail.

TSX69
Profile for TSX69
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-05-2018 13:13
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Hybrids:

Fusion 4,169 +16.6%
Camry 2,913 +33.6%
Accord 1,160 -62.9%
Optima 1,007 +153.7%
Sonata 543 -60.5%
Avalon 446 -56.5%
Malibu 370 -53.2%

Fusion 57,474 +70.8%
Accord 22,008 +139.8%
Camry 20,985 -5.6%
Sonata 9,550 -49.6%
Optima 5,537 -9.9%
Avalon 4,990 -41%
Malibu 4,452 +2.7%

Rav4 4,846 +1.5%
Niro 2,397
HighLander 1,606 +57.8%
Rogue 402

Rav4 50,559 +12.2%
Niro 27,237
HighLander 16,864 +182.2%
Rogue 1,066

ES 549 -25.2%
MKZ 495 -25.8%
Q50 56 -75.9%
LaCrosse 55 +111.5%

MKZ 5,931 -17.8%
ES 5,394 -29.4%
Q50 870 -56.5%
LaCrosse 506 -33.9%

RLX 69 +122.6%
Q70 4 -66.7%
GS450h 3 -50%

RLX 292 +24.3%
Q70 58 -50.8%
GS450h 50 -28.6%

RX450h 967 -1.8%
NX 731 +101.9%
MDX 228

RX450h 8,568 +.1%
NX 3,323 +16.9%
MDX 1,807

vh2k
Profile for vh2k
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-05-2018 13:14
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Bullwinkle wrote:
vh2k wrote:
Rogue, RAV4, CRV, Grand Cherokee, Explorer, Highlander

Those numbers are astronomical!!!



The impressive thing is that the CR-V even got close to the Rogue and RAV4. I rented a car recently at an Airport National and i the place was littered with Rogues and RAV4s. When I drove back to the airport, one entire return line was nothing but Rogues. I counted 15 nose-to-tail.



Gotta add that the Escape and Equinox did very well. Those eight SUV/CUV models alone account for 2.4MM units in 2017. Truly staggering.

lexusgs
Profile for lexusgs
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-05-2018 13:17
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BallerMDX wrote:
Thanx for the hard work TSX69.

With all the praise Lexus gets, shocking their sedans/coupe (with the exception of the Avalon-based ES) doing this badly, even by luxury car standards. It will be interesting to see how well the revamped LS and all new LC change this. I think Lexus hit the ball out of the universe with the interior design of the LC in particular. As for the LS, it's certainly not your grandpa's LS, but something about it just doesn't say premium/flagship to me. Can't put my finger on it.



Most Lexus sedans are at the end of their product cycles and have been on the market for a long time now. The GS debuted in 2012 as a 2013 model, the LS debuted all the way back in 2006 as a 2007 model, it received a pretty large refresh in 2012 but it is still the same basic car.

Lexus does not offer attractive lease deals anymore, they are actually worse then they were a few years ago and the updates with the big grills and making 4 cylinders standard on the IS and GS and raising the price on the 6 cylinders have not helped sales. The GS lacks a intermediate higher hp engine too, you go from 310hp 6 cylinder priced in the 50's to a 476hp V8 priced in the 80's.

LC is priced too high to get big sales and unfortunately I don't think the new LS is going to be a big seller.

ES is a big hit despite being just a average car, no reason the Acura TLX should be so behind the ES but they managed to do it with making the TLX smallish, so cost cut and putting a weak 4 cylinder standard with that awful touch screen.

Despite all this Lexus sedans still sell decently, I am sure Acura would love for the RLX to sell in GS numbers or even LS/RC coupe numbers.


BallerMDX
Profile for BallerMDX
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-05-2018 14:54
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lexusgs wrote:
BallerMDX wrote:
Thanx for the hard work TSX69.

With all the praise Lexus gets, shocking their sedans/coupe (with the exception of the Avalon-based ES) doing this badly, even by luxury car standards. It will be interesting to see how well the revamped LS and all new LC change this. I think Lexus hit the ball out of the universe with the interior design of the LC in particular. As for the LS, it's certainly not your grandpa's LS, but something about it just doesn't say premium/flagship to me. Can't put my finger on it.



Most Lexus sedans are at the end of their product cycles and have been on the market for a long time now. The GS debuted in 2012 as a 2013 model, the LS debuted all the way back in 2006 as a 2007 model, it received a pretty large refresh in 2012 but it is still the same basic car.

Lexus does not offer attractive lease deals anymore, they are actually worse then they were a few years ago and the updates with the big grills and making 4 cylinders standard on the IS and GS and raising the price on the 6 cylinders have not helped sales. The GS lacks a intermediate higher hp engine too, you go from 310hp 6 cylinder priced in the 50's to a 476hp V8 priced in the 80's.

LC is priced too high to get big sales and unfortunately I don't think the new LS is going to be a big seller.

ES is a big hit despite being just a average car, no reason the Acura TLX should be so behind the ES but they managed to do it with making the TLX smallish, so cost cut and putting a weak 4 cylinder standard with that awful touch screen.

Despite all this Lexus sedans still sell decently, I am sure Acura would love for the RLX to sell in GS numbers or even LS/RC coupe numbers.




Nice try but this post was about Lexus so letís not bring up Acura to justify poor Lexus sedan sales. We all know the state of Acura sedan sales. Also, Lexus sedan sales have been lackluster for several years now so letís not try to use the excuse that these models are near then end of their life cycle. Q50 is just as old as IS yet it has sold much better even before the switch to 4 cyclinder based engines in the IS. BTW, Iím sure you are aware most other luxury manufacturers are doing the same switch from V6 to 4 cyclinder turbos in this segment.

Maybe the lack of good lease deals plays a roll in poor sales and of course competition from SUVs, but a good part of it is that ugly grill. Lexus core buyers arenít interested in flashy or polarizing designs, even less so than Acura core buyers. I do agree with you about the LC and LS sales prospects though.


cksi1372
Profile for cksi1372
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-05-2018 16:22
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Another "thank you" TSX, great info!

I know this is a Honda/Acura forum, but tough to see the Mazda numbers. Such a great little maker (reminds me of Honda of old), but can't seem to move the needle other than the CX-5 and CX-9 somewhat. Still small numbers overall, however. Hope they survive.

lexusgs
Profile for lexusgs
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-05-2018 18:58
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BallerMDX wrote:
lexusgs wrote:
BallerMDX wrote:
Thanx for the hard work TSX69.

With all the praise Lexus gets, shocking their sedans/coupe (with the exception of the Avalon-based ES) doing this badly, even by luxury car standards. It will be interesting to see how well the revamped LS and all new LC change this. I think Lexus hit the ball out of the universe with the interior design of the LC in particular. As for the LS, it's certainly not your grandpa's LS, but something about it just doesn't say premium/flagship to me. Can't put my finger on it.



Most Lexus sedans are at the end of their product cycles and have been on the market for a long time now. The GS debuted in 2012 as a 2013 model, the LS debuted all the way back in 2006 as a 2007 model, it received a pretty large refresh in 2012 but it is still the same basic car.

Lexus does not offer attractive lease deals anymore, they are actually worse then they were a few years ago and the updates with the big grills and making 4 cylinders standard on the IS and GS and raising the price on the 6 cylinders have not helped sales. The GS lacks a intermediate higher hp engine too, you go from 310hp 6 cylinder priced in the 50's to a 476hp V8 priced in the 80's.

LC is priced too high to get big sales and unfortunately I don't think the new LS is going to be a big seller.

ES is a big hit despite being just a average car, no reason the Acura TLX should be so behind the ES but they managed to do it with making the TLX smallish, so cost cut and putting a weak 4 cylinder standard with that awful touch screen.

Despite all this Lexus sedans still sell decently, I am sure Acura would love for the RLX to sell in GS numbers or even LS/RC coupe numbers.




Nice try but this post was about Lexus so letís not bring up Acura to justify poor Lexus sedan sales. We all know the state of Acura sedan sales. Also, Lexus sedan sales have been lackluster for several years now so letís not try to use the excuse that these models are near then end of their life cycle. Q50 is just as old as IS yet it has sold much better even before the switch to 4 cyclinder based engines in the IS. BTW, Iím sure you are aware most other luxury manufacturers are doing the same switch from V6 to 4 cyclinder turbos in this segment.

Maybe the lack of good lease deals plays a roll in poor sales and of course competition from SUVs, but a good part of it is that ugly grill. Lexus core buyers arenít interested in flashy or polarizing designs, even less so than Acura core buyers. I do agree with you about the LC and LS sales prospects though.



It was not a try, it was facts. Lexus sedans are well at the end of their cycles and have been on the market for a long time, same with most of the engines. Q50 sells better then IS at times because IS sales are split with the similarly priced ES and the Q50 is much roomier and less expensive.

European brands like BMW and Mercedes can get away with 4cyl based of the badge, not the same with Japanese brands.

I agree, the new grill they are plastering on Lexus cars is pretty ugly but the rest of the cars have pretty good designs/proportion. The pre 2016 GS had a nice look before the new grill, same with the pre 2013 LS, and pre MMC ES was nice looking.

BallerMDX
Profile for BallerMDX
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-05-2018 21:28
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lexusgs wrote:
BallerMDX wrote:
lexusgs wrote:
BallerMDX wrote:
Thanx for the hard work TSX69.

With all the praise Lexus gets, shocking their sedans/coupe (with the exception of the Avalon-based ES) doing this badly, even by luxury car standards. It will be interesting to see how well the revamped LS and all new LC change this. I think Lexus hit the ball out of the universe with the interior design of the LC in particular. As for the LS, it's certainly not your grandpa's LS, but something about it just doesn't say premium/flagship to me. Can't put my finger on it.



Most Lexus sedans are at the end of their product cycles and have been on the market for a long time now. The GS debuted in 2012 as a 2013 model, the LS debuted all the way back in 2006 as a 2007 model, it received a pretty large refresh in 2012 but it is still the same basic car.

Lexus does not offer attractive lease deals anymore, they are actually worse then they were a few years ago and the updates with the big grills and making 4 cylinders standard on the IS and GS and raising the price on the 6 cylinders have not helped sales. The GS lacks a intermediate higher hp engine too, you go from 310hp 6 cylinder priced in the 50's to a 476hp V8 priced in the 80's.

LC is priced too high to get big sales and unfortunately I don't think the new LS is going to be a big seller.

ES is a big hit despite being just a average car, no reason the Acura TLX should be so behind the ES but they managed to do it with making the TLX smallish, so cost cut and putting a weak 4 cylinder standard with that awful touch screen.

Despite all this Lexus sedans still sell decently, I am sure Acura would love for the RLX to sell in GS numbers or even LS/RC coupe numbers.




Nice try but this post was about Lexus so letís not bring up Acura to justify poor Lexus sedan sales. We all know the state of Acura sedan sales. Also, Lexus sedan sales have been lackluster for several years now so letís not try to use the excuse that these models are near then end of their life cycle. Q50 is just as old as IS yet it has sold much better even before the switch to 4 cyclinder based engines in the IS. BTW, Iím sure you are aware most other luxury manufacturers are doing the same switch from V6 to 4 cyclinder turbos in this segment.

Maybe the lack of good lease deals plays a roll in poor sales and of course competition from SUVs, but a good part of it is that ugly grill. Lexus core buyers arenít interested in flashy or polarizing designs, even less so than Acura core buyers. I do agree with you about the LC and LS sales prospects though.



It was not a try, it was facts. Lexus sedans are well at the end of their cycles and have been on the market for a long time, same with most of the engines. Q50 sells better then IS at times because IS sales are split with the similarly priced ES and the Q50 is much roomier and less expensive.

European brands like BMW and Mercedes can get away with 4cyl based of the badge, not the same with Japanese brands.

I agree, the new grill they are plastering on Lexus cars is pretty ugly but the rest of the cars have pretty good designs/proportion. The pre 2016 GS had a nice look before the new grill, same with the pre 2013 LS, and pre MMC ES was nice looking.



And the#facts are also that Lexus sedans have been sluggish for several years, so it is a nice try. Shall I post numbers? Anyway, OK so the Japs can't do as the Germans and offer 4-cylinder turbos as the base option in luxury models and get away with it. Let's run with that, as I do somewhat agree. Soooo, what's the excuse for the GS and LS? The LS is still in line with or above its BMW, Mercedes, Audi counterparts and offers a traditional V8 as the base option. Yet sales have suffered for a while now. Even you agree the brand new LS will likely not do well. Why is that, when your argument is mostly based on the FACT that Lexus sedan sales suffer because they are aging?

As for the 200t 4-cylinder GS, it is/was pretty much non-existent at most Lexus dealerships. If you're going in to buy a GS, you're getting the GS 350 more than likely, which can be had at $52K or so. So you can't say GS sales suffer because of its base 4 turbo when the GS 350 V6 is really the standard model and starts out at the same price point as the E 300 with a 4-cylinder turbo. And again, GS sales were suffering prior to the introduction of the 200t in 2016.

Also do you really believe many customers are crossing-shopping the much larger, front-wheel drive-based ES with the compact, FR-based, more sports-oriented (ha ha ha) IS? Don't think so.

lexusgs
Profile for lexusgs
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-06-2018 10:53
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BallerMDX wrote:
lexusgs wrote:
BallerMDX wrote:
lexusgs wrote:
BallerMDX wrote:
Thanx for the hard work TSX69.

With all the praise Lexus gets, shocking their sedans/coupe (with the exception of the Avalon-based ES) doing this badly, even by luxury car standards. It will be interesting to see how well the revamped LS and all new LC change this. I think Lexus hit the ball out of the universe with the interior design of the LC in particular. As for the LS, it's certainly not your grandpa's LS, but something about it just doesn't say premium/flagship to me. Can't put my finger on it.



Most Lexus sedans are at the end of their product cycles and have been on the market for a long time now. The GS debuted in 2012 as a 2013 model, the LS debuted all the way back in 2006 as a 2007 model, it received a pretty large refresh in 2012 but it is still the same basic car.

Lexus does not offer attractive lease deals anymore, they are actually worse then they were a few years ago and the updates with the big grills and making 4 cylinders standard on the IS and GS and raising the price on the 6 cylinders have not helped sales. The GS lacks a intermediate higher hp engine too, you go from 310hp 6 cylinder priced in the 50's to a 476hp V8 priced in the 80's.

LC is priced too high to get big sales and unfortunately I don't think the new LS is going to be a big seller.

ES is a big hit despite being just a average car, no reason the Acura TLX should be so behind the ES but they managed to do it with making the TLX smallish, so cost cut and putting a weak 4 cylinder standard with that awful touch screen.

Despite all this Lexus sedans still sell decently, I am sure Acura would love for the RLX to sell in GS numbers or even LS/RC coupe numbers.




Nice try but this post was about Lexus so letís not bring up Acura to justify poor Lexus sedan sales. We all know the state of Acura sedan sales. Also, Lexus sedan sales have been lackluster for several years now so letís not try to use the excuse that these models are near then end of their life cycle. Q50 is just as old as IS yet it has sold much better even before the switch to 4 cyclinder based engines in the IS. BTW, Iím sure you are aware most other luxury manufacturers are doing the same switch from V6 to 4 cyclinder turbos in this segment.

Maybe the lack of good lease deals plays a roll in poor sales and of course competition from SUVs, but a good part of it is that ugly grill. Lexus core buyers arenít interested in flashy or polarizing designs, even less so than Acura core buyers. I do agree with you about the LC and LS sales prospects though.



It was not a try, it was facts. Lexus sedans are well at the end of their cycles and have been on the market for a long time, same with most of the engines. Q50 sells better then IS at times because IS sales are split with the similarly priced ES and the Q50 is much roomier and less expensive.

European brands like BMW and Mercedes can get away with 4cyl based of the badge, not the same with Japanese brands.

I agree, the new grill they are plastering on Lexus cars is pretty ugly but the rest of the cars have pretty good designs/proportion. The pre 2016 GS had a nice look before the new grill, same with the pre 2013 LS, and pre MMC ES was nice looking.



And the#facts are also that Lexus sedans have been sluggish for several years, so it is a nice try. Shall I post numbers? Anyway, OK so the Japs can't do as the Germans and offer 4-cylinder turbos as the base option in luxury models and get away with it. Let's run with that, as I do somewhat agree. Soooo, what's the excuse for the GS and LS? The LS is still in line with or above its BMW, Mercedes, Audi counterparts and offers a traditional V8 as the base option. Yet sales have suffered for a while now. Even you agree the brand new LS will likely not do well. Why is that, when your argument is mostly based on the FACT that Lexus sedan sales suffer because they are aging?

As for the 200t 4-cylinder GS, it is/was pretty much non-existent at most Lexus dealerships. If you're going in to buy a GS, you're getting the GS 350 more than likely, which can be had at $52K or so. So you can't say GS sales suffer because of its base 4 turbo when the GS 350 V6 is really the standard model and starts out at the same price point as the E 300 with a 4-cylinder turbo. And again, GS sales were suffering prior to the introduction of the 200t in 2016.

Also do you really believe many customers are crossing-shopping the much larger, front-wheel drive-based ES with the compact, FR-based, more sports-oriented (ha ha ha) IS? Don't think so.



The sales for the GS fell drastically for the 2016 model when they introduced that awful 4 cyl as the standard engine, raised the price on the 6 cylinder, added that big ugly grill, and took away the good lease deals. Post the numbers and you will see decent sales from the GS until the 2016 model. The GS was never a very big seller anyway. Most Lexus dealerships barely even have the GS on their lots anymore but the 2.0t is not nonexistent and they did raise the price on the 6 cylinder which is a long in the tooth engine.

The new LS only has a turbo 6 engine, its styling inside or out is not very good, it is priced too high, and the Genesis G90 offers a less expensive alternative unlike before. Sales will improve but it I don't see it being much of a hit. I think the new A8 is going to be a flop too not that it was ever a big seller, its interior is bland and terrible, exterior nothing special.

Yes, a portion of Lexus customers do cross shop the IS and ES which are priced similarly, they see the ES is less expensive with a 6 cylinder and has more room. When a company has 2 very similar priced sedans, they will be cross shopped and eat some sales from each other, the cheaper one pretty much always wins especially if it is roomier.

jyrtl
Profile for jyrtl
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-06-2018 12:58
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Thank you TSX69 I look forward each month have a great year with the stats ;)
Insightman
Profile for Insightman
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-06-2018 14:10
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Will Honda always lump the sales numbers of the Clarity Plug-In Hybrids, Electrics, and Fuel Cells together? It will be interesting to see if Honda actually has a marketing budget for the Plug-In. Right now I've seen only one 30-second spot and I don't believe it's showing anywhere but YouTube.
TSX69
Profile for TSX69
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-07-2018 07:07
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Adding in the VW Atlas:

Explorer 25,375 +33.3%
Grand Cherokee 23,662 +2%
HighLander 21,041 -14.1%
Pilot 18,602 +60%
Edge 13,660 +7.6%
SantaFe 13,146
Traverse 12,313 +18.6%
Acadia 10,837 -11.1%
Murano 9,718 +23.3%
Sorento 7,740
Atlas 6,070
PathFinder 6,053 -35.4%
Durango 5,547 -4%
CX9 3,276 +26.3%
OutLander 3,018
Toureg 484 +22.2%

Grand Cherokee 240,696 +13%
Explorer 238,056 +10.1%
HighLander 215,775 +13.1%
Edge 142,603 +6%
SantaFe 133,171
Pilot 127,279 +5.7%
Traverse 123,506%
Acadia 111,276 +25.8%
Sorento 99,684
PathFinder 81,701 -.8%
Murano 76,732 -11.8%
Durango 68,761 0%
OutLander 35,310
Atlas 27,119
CX9 25,828 +60.9%
Touareg 3,545 -16.1%

Waldo
Profile for Waldo
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-07-2018 10:58
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Thanks again for your considerable efforts.

BTW, there is another player now: the Hyundai Santa Fe Sport. This a new CR-V competitor, a 2-row CUV. It is as different from the regular Santa Fe as the Cherokee is from the Grand Cherokee. Not much (if anything) is shared. I don't know if Hyundai is listing it separately in sales figures, but it is marketed separately on the web site.

Ganplosive
Profile for Ganplosive
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-07-2018 22:10
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Thank you thank you thank you
TSX69
Profile for TSX69
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-08-2018 06:29
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Waldo wrote:
BTW, there is another player now: the Hyundai Santa Fe Sport. This a new CR-V competitor, a 2-row CUV. It is as different from the regular Santa Fe as the Cherokee is from the Grand Cherokee. Not much (if anything) is shared. I don't know if Hyundai is listing it separately in sales figures, but it is marketed separately on the web site.


Hyundai does not breakout the SantaFe sales

http://www.hyundainews.com/en-us/releases/2451

Most reviews consider it a mid-size so I guess it is just considered part of the SantaFe family & not separate model like the OutLander.

Fitdad
Profile for Fitdad
Re: Year End Comparison #s [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-11-2018 09:57
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Thank you TSX69.

 
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