vtechbrain
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The handling coments are welcome,. What about acceleration impressions?
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Tuan
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Seat of the pants suggests that the RL is faster than all the competitor cars present, but not as fast as a 6MT TL in a straight line. On a grippy surface, the 6MT TL should be able to beat the RL courtesy of the TL's 6MT. The RL is hindered by the auto in this respect. Though with SH-AWD, on slippery surfaces, I suspect the RL will pull away easily.
Thankfully, I did NOT notice the 5th gear low speed vibration that TL's exhibit.
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CivicB18
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Althought the 260lbft should be more than adequate, I was hoping for a little bit more torque from the reworked J35. I was expecting more like 270-275. I was assuming peak torque would at least equal the output of say a 350Z VQ (280lbft). But Im sure the curve is much better than the Z's.
Patrick
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vtechbrain
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Good, that means I wont be tempted to switch cars in less than 2 years:). Thankfully my TL has never had any vibratory problems. My guess is that in the auto the tranny settings make the engine lug at that speed. In all truth, Ive found that the engine produces little torque below 2K and forcing to accelerate below that point will cause some shivers. Maybe a little tranny reprograming is in order. Seems to be akin to the second gear lubrication problem. I think the tranny shift points for the 6 cylinder Hondas might be trying to conserve fuel a little to aggressively.
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TonyEX
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I assume you're talking about the MTs?
Then you're not kidding.. have you ever driven a 2nd gen TL or CL? The Base trim, not Type S.... they seemed to be geared for escape velocity top speed. Good luck using 4th or 5th for passing the smoking the slow 86 Diesel GM car ahead of you... And if you ask the sportshift for a lower gear the darn light just blinks and blinks like the Energizer Bunny (or Mothers Against Speeding Cars).
vtechbrain wrote:
. I think the tranny shift points for the 6 cylinder Hondas might be trying to conserve fuel a little to aggressively.
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vtechbrain
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I never drove the base, I had a typeS. The S down shifted with authority. But my comments were regarding the 3rd gen and the often quoted vibration at 55 (Ive never felt it in neither the auto or my MT).
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BOOMER
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The 350Z doesn't have a torque curve, most of its 274lbs is available just off idle and peaks at 4800 rpm. A very small peak, it pulls like a small block V8 from the start.
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BOOMER
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The 350Z doesn't have a torque curve, most of its 274lbs is available just off idle and peaks at 4800 rpm. A very small peak, it pulls like a small block V8 from the start.
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JeffX
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The TL Type S had the same lousy 4th and 5th gearing. I think I once calculated the theoretical 5th gear top speed at the limiter at something ridiculous like 260 or 290mph. Insane.
TonyE wrote:
I assume you're talking about the MTs?
Then you're not kidding.. have you ever driven a 2nd gen TL or CL? The Base trim, not Type S.... they seemed to be geared for escape velocity top speed. Good luck using 4th or 5th for passing the smoking the slow 86 Diesel GM car ahead of you... And if you ask the sportshift for a lower gear the darn light just blinks and blinks like the Energizer Bunny (or Mothers Against Speeding Cars).
vtechbrain wrote:
. I think the tranny shift points for the 6 cylinder Hondas might be trying to conserve fuel a little to aggressively.
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vtechbrain
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Alright! I did a web search and found out the following, ATTS IS an electromechanical clutch system, MY BAD. The car also included 4 wheel steering which is where my confusion stems from!
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TonyEX
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Hate to break the news to you... but AWS and ATTS were never offered in the same generation. The Prelude AWS was an older late 80s to early 90s model (with pop up headlights). The Prelude Type SH was on the last generation.
vtechbrain wrote:
Alright! I did a web search and found out the following, ATTS IS an electromechanical clutch system, MY BAD. The car also included 4 wheel steering which is where my confusion stems from!
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vtechbrain
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Try this site http://hondaprelude.sitemynet.com/tech.html
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TonyEX
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Oh boy.... that site is full of omissions....
(1) The page you quoted throws in 4WS but it doesn't say when it was available. The page refers to the VTi technology but if you look at their own VTi technology page you will note no mention of 4WS, but they mention the ATTS for the SH... and they forget to note that an MT5 transmission was the only option in the SH.... as I say, that web site it's got lots of holes.
(2) Now, in the USA, 4WS was offered two generations back. The last two generations of Preludes did not offer 4WS and ATTS was only offered in the last generation.
Look, I know my Preludes... I had a 99 SH. I wanted a Prelude ever since the 2.0Si from the early 90s. Before that they suffered from the Quaalude syndrome.... :-P
Perhaps you can show me another page where they show that maybe in JDM they offered 4WS in the last gen? But don't trust that page you quoted me, it's imcomplete.
vtechbrain wrote:
Try this site http://hondaprelude.sitemynet.com/tech.html
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jcn02acc
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4WS was offered in the late eighties thru 1996. ATTS on the SH was 97-01.
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notyper
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Not quite. On the 350Z's I've dyno'd (and other VQs to a lesser extent), they're making about 80% of peak torque at 2000 rpm, climbing rapidly between 2000 and 3000 rpm. Levels off there until about 5000 rpm (just after peak) where the curve drops like a stone down to about 80% of peak at 6400 rpm.
SC
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HJV
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Tuan, I have a 6 sp TL. I've not noticed a low speed vibration in fifth gear. I presume you're talking about the six speed? How does this vibration manifest itself, through the shifter, chassis, or what, and should I be looking for it as time passes?
Mine is an HPT and I do sure notice the quite rough ride for the first couple miles in cold weather, almost as old nylon bias plies used to behave. But once they've warmed up or in more temperate weather, they're at least as smooth and quiet as my wife's automatic, and certainly more fun.
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TonyEX
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Huh, I don't believe the "soap bar" Prelude in the mid 90s had AWS, did it?
As I recall, the 96 only had two models, S and Si. The S offered the 4SAT with sportshift and 195bhp. The S and Si offered the MT5 with 200bhp.
The last 4WS offered was with the pop up headlights car made in the late 80s and early 90s.
The SH was introduced in the last gen.
jcn02acc wrote:
4WS was offered in the late eighties thru 1996. ATTS on the SH was 97-01.
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JeffX
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No, there was in fact a 4th gen 4WS model. It had Si hardware (160hp) otherwise. IIRC, it was priced similar to the 190hp VTEC model, which undoubtedly hurt its popularity. For some reason I don't think it made it all the way to the end of the G4 run. It may have faded in '94 or '95.
TonyE wrote:
Huh, I don't believe the "soap bar" Prelude in the mid 90s had AWS, did it?
As I recall, the 96 only had two models, S and Si. The S offered the 4SAT with sportshift and 195bhp. The S and Si offered the MT5 with 200bhp.
The last 4WS offered was with the pop up headlights car made in the late 80s and early 90s.
The SH was introduced in the last gen.
jcn02acc wrote:
4WS was offered in the late eighties thru 1996. ATTS on the SH was 97-01.
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BOOMER
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Having never dynoed a car, I'll take your word for the exact numbers. I just push the accelerator to the floor and it roars off, getting louder until the fuel cutoff. Having owned a 59 283 ci Chevy small block, their behavior is much the same.
Since 80% of the available torque is available at 2000 rpm, thats 220lbs ft, only 54 lbs ft to the peak at 4800 rpm in 2800 rpms more makes the engine feel like it has a mostly flat torque curve to me. Its also a huge difference from my 97 Accord which switched to vtec over 4000 rpm, the Z never gives you a feeling of "getting on the cam", much less vtec. The VQ doesn't have much in common with the AH engines as far as feeling transitions go, despite its numbers on a dyno.
The 04 TL is so quiet in operation, even at WOT, its hard to tell transitions there also. Its a little quieter than I like, in fact, I would like a little more wide-open sound. This is why a TSX could be more fun to drive than cars with the Z's and TL's power, you are going over the speed limit in the other two, the TSX makes engine music longer than they do and can be enjoyed more w/o losing your liscence or your life.
I believe the testers from Car and Driver pointed it out w/the TSX. Our road system is so antiquated, high speeds are to be found only in Europe, where they have changed their highway system to accomodate fast travel. We haven't changed our transit plans since the 1930s.
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revvin
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3rd gen. 1988-1991 & 4th gen. 1992-1996 had 4ws, except 95 and 96 when the slow-selling 4ws was dropped, these were the model years that the fastest stock Prelude were made.
Qualude? are we talking about the fourth gen? or the 86-89 accord four door ludes.
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NSXman
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They do get insanely good milage for such powerful 6 cylinder engines 29-30mpg (the TL models of past and current). If VCM were fitted to a TL, you could even get 32-33mpg on the highway.
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