RolledaNsx
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In the first practice it was 9th, one second off the lead.
And it has more, starting the set up conservative.
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sadlerau
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I wish I shared your optimisim. While it is ealy days, and the front runners are vastly experienced, 1 second is a LONG time in professional motorsport. It would need to be a very conservative set-up to be so far off the pace, and still be a good thing.
But I wish them well, and am envious that you're there on the ground!! :)
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P54
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See video here:
http://www.fiawtcc.com/
MONTEIRO: WE ARE RIGHT ON SCHEDULE
Tiago Monteiro set the ninth fastest lap in today’s test session at at Suzuka, on the very first outing of his Honda Civic in the World Touring Car Championship.
Monteiro’s fastest lap of 54.147 was one second off Yvan Muller’s the leading pace.“It was not bad. To be one second behind the Chevrolet cars after only a couple of months of work is a good starting point. Especially when we see that they have improved last year’s track record,” commented the Portuguese racer.
“It feels good to be here, comparing ourselves with the rest of the field. We stay stick to our plan of developing
the car, but it was nice to be in the middle of the field. We have some additional information now, and we will analyze them to see where we may improve. This first test was interesting and we are quite happy for what we are doing so far. We are right on schedule.”
Your goal was to make the top ten and you achieved it. “Yes, the red flags came at the wrong times for me, as for a few other people, but we are where we wanted to be. And now we have to try and be closer. I pushed hard, without going for a qualifying set up. The car was rather set up for the races. So, there is a margin of improvement, no doubt about it. Both for the car and myself.”
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RolledaNsx
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2nd practice
6th.....just .445 secs from pole
Not bad for not having any history in the books for that track on set ups.... just doing it out of the blue!
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DrWhiner
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I think Honda is fully aware the race car is still under development stage. They are persuaded to enter a few races in 2012 to see how far ahead the others are. BTW, don't forget the JAS race car is subjected to an additional 40kg late entry ballast.
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WongKN
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Top 10 in both races. Not that bad though I think the field itself is not that large so someone with a negative perspective can also say that the Civic finished in the bottom half of the grid I suppose. All depends on how sympathetic one is to Honda. Still, I looked at the total race time and the WTCC Civic is not that far off so I for one thinks its a good effort for so short a timeframe.
I have the Honda press release up at Honda Fan if anyone wants to read the official Honda PR. Plus some photos as well (nice looking car I might add).
http://tovahondafan.blogspot.com/2012/10/civic-wtcc-finishesits-first-race.html
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DrWhiner
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IIRC, the Civic WTCC race car was raised to 9th in the first race.
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330R
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DrWhiner wrote:
IIRC, the Civic WTCC race car was raised to 9th in the first race.
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Uh, yeah, that's what the results on TOVA say. Please try and keep up.
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DrWhiner
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A case of myopia or, may I guess, Presbyopia?
| Top 10 in both races. Not that bad though I think the field itself .... |
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WongKN
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It's actually 9th in race-1 and 10th in race-2. The Honda press release was on the Honda Fan article linked in my post. Now looking forward to its next race.
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danielgr
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WongKN wrote:
It's actually 9th in race-1 and 10th in race-2. The Honda press release was on the Honda Fan article linked in my post. Now looking forward to its next race.
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In race one there was simply a car that was disqualified after the race was over.
PS1: If they had been 9th on race1 they would have started race2 from pole; that would have been nice to watch....
PS2: For anyone interested, full-races can be seen on youtube (do a search...)
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WongKN
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This was what the Honda press release says. They are probably only interested in the final results.
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danielgr
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WongKN wrote:
This was what the Honda press release says. They are probably only interested in the final results.
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Well, that is obviously accurate in terms of results, I was just saying that "performance wise" they were still 10 and 10 as DrWhiner said.
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P54
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Previous picture of the 1.6L turbo engine for the WTCC car was kind of obscure. Now look at this picture and you will see the real thing. See the beautifully crafted headers, the narrow valve angle and the general compactness of the engine. Do we see the new "R" or Si engine?? If so count me in.
Here is the previous picture:
Here is the beauty revealed, oh what an engine!
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BachelorFrog
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^ why the URL has 'Civic-16-Diesel' in it?
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P54
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BachelorFrog wrote:
^ why the URL has 'Civic-16-Diesel' in it?
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Because I got the picture from a link where they showed the new Civic with 1.6L diesel. The engine was shown at the Paris Motor Show.
http://autocarinterior.com/honda-civic-diesel-1-6l-with-earth-dream-technology/
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P54
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Shanghai results:
Honda Civic 7th (race 1) and 10th (race 2).
Race 1 was then changed to 13th because of drive through penalty given to 5 drivers in race 1 and to 1 driver in race 2.
Corrected results: Race 1: 13th........Race 2: 10th
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BachelorFrog
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I am confused. Is Honda using 1.6 Diesel in WTCC?
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P54
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BachelorFrog wrote:
I am confused. Is Honda using 1.6 Diesel in WTCC?
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No! The WTCC engine is a dedicated engine HR412E and runs on gasoline. It is a 1.6L turbo, developed by Honda R&D in Tochigi, to comply with the rules. It might be the engine for next CTR.
The 1.6L diesel engine is for the new Civic and CR-V 2WD for Europe.
The WTCC engine was shown together with the new Civic 1.6L diesel at the Paris Motor Show. Maybe the journalist taking the pictures and posting them did not differentiate between the WTCC and diesel engine so the link address for the WTCC engine is same as for the diesel.
Look up the link I gave you and see more pictures of the Civic and the WTCC engine. The diesel is ED and you can see on the pictures how different it looks from the WTCC engine.
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CarPhreakD
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The external wastegate on the headers is beautifully crafted on the petrol engine... but do my eyes deceive me or is the turbo on the 1.6 diesel actually located that high up in the engine? Honda probably did that for packaging, but that's usually a terrible spot... Fiat's 1.4L engineers did something similar and the manifold had to be reinforced heavily so that it would not crack with the turbo placed so high up.
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BachelorFrog
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P54 wrote:
BachelorFrog wrote:
I am confused. Is Honda using 1.6 Diesel in WTCC?
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No! The WTCC engine is a dedicated engine HR412E and runs on gasoline. It is a 1.6L turbo, developed by Honda R&D in Tochigi, to comply with the rules. It might be the engine for next CTR.
The 1.6L diesel engine is for the new Civic and CR-V 2WD for Europe.
The WTCC engine was shown together with the new Civic 1.6L diesel at the Paris Motor Show. Maybe the journalist taking the pictures and posting them did not differentiate between the WTCC and diesel engine so the link address for the WTCC engine is same as for the diesel.
Look up the link I gave you and see more pictures of the Civic and the WTCC engine. The diesel is ED and you can see on the pictures how different it looks from the WTCC engine.
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Lazy journalists LOL!
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sadlerau
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I must say I'm really impressed with the pace of the Civic at Macau. RolledaNSX was accurate in his statement that they had been running a conservative set-up and engine mapping, as an interview with Monteiro explained basically the same thing.
Roll on 2013.
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RolledaNsx
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They don't want to scare the other teams too soon.
At the dyno... that engine is a beast!!!!
I wonder where it is going in a production car?
I always knew the BTTC engine was going into the the Euro CTR.
So is the WTTC engine going into the Global CTR if there is going to be one?
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Double J
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RolledaNsx wrote:
They don't want to scare the other teams too soon.
At the dyno... that engine is a beast!!!!
I wonder where it is going in a production car?
I always knew the BTTC engine was going into the the Euro CTR.
So is the WTTC engine going into the Global CTR if there is going to be one?
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I was kind of hoping that the 1.6l would make it into the fit, crz, or the Beat and the 2.0l would be for the CTR and at least something for NA. I'd like to know what they feel like.
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owequitit
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RolledaNsx wrote:
They don't want to scare the other teams too soon.
At the dyno... that engine is a beast!!!!
I wonder where it is going in a production car?
I always knew the BTTC engine was going into the the Euro CTR.
So is the WTTC engine going into the Global CTR if there is going to be one?
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So wait, they went racing because they don't want to scare the other competitors by winning?
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owequitit
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I agree.
Take away the tubular manifold, replace it with a cast iron one, put a smaller turbo and probably a large host of other internal changes, and we might have a CTR engine. Of course, then they will have to convince me how Honda was able to get a cast manifold engine with a fat turbo sucking EGT's to meet US emissions standards, but they can't get an NA engine with a tubular manifold to do it because we all know that is pure B.S.
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RolledaNsx
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Don't need much internal changes because the WTTC engine must last the whole season.
They could do the NA K20 but at the time they didn't want to spend the money on a limited production engine to meet the emission standards.Things change now.... the masses has spoken.... we want a high rev "halo" Civic!!!
To meet the power goals(150hp per liter) and keep the engine from 10,000 rpm redline(to make it last),it must be turbo.
But the good side is the torque its going to make.
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P54
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owequitit wrote:
I agree.
Take away the tubular manifold, replace it with a cast iron one, put a smaller turbo and probably a large host of other internal changes, and we might have a CTR engine. Of course, then they will have to convince me how Honda was able to get a cast manifold engine with a fat turbo sucking EGT's to meet US emissions standards, but they can't get an NA engine with a tubular manifold to do it because we all know that is pure B.S.
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Just because Honda withdrew NSX and CTR because of emission does not mean Honda could not make the engines pass emission. Honda did not want to spend the money updating the engines to new standards as they knew it would only be temporary as even stricter emissions is coming. They decided to spend the money on new engines that would last into the future.
There is a difference between saying they do not want to spend money updating a current but old engine design and saying they are not able to make high revving NA engines to pass emission. Honda did not say they can't do it, they just decided on making new power trains and cars.
Recession and natural disasters delayed the new engines and cars.
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P54
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sadlerau wrote:
I must say I'm really impressed with the pace of the Civic at Macau. RolledaNSX was accurate in his statement that they had been running a conservative set-up and engine mapping, as an interview with Monteiro explained basically the same thing.
Roll on 2013.
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Interesting to see how surefooted the FWD cars are and how the RWD BMW's spin out of control.
Civic WTCC finishes 2012 WTCC season finale on the podium
http://www.hondanews.eu/en/news/index.pmode/modul,detail,0,2559-DEFAULT,21,text,1/index.pmode
FIRST PODIUM FOR MONTEIRO AND HONDA
http://www.fiawtcc.com/
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sadlerau
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owequitit wrote:
So wait, they went racing because they don't want to scare the other competitors by winning?
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You obviously don't know a lot about racing, do you? The Civic is next year's car, to show it's full capabilities this season would be silly, giving the opposition knowledge of the target they must aim for the following year.
In 20 odd years in motorsport I've always held the belief you don't win by anymore than you have too, as it's nice to have something in reserve :)
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