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DanielAcosta
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2013 Honda Accord Test Drive and Review: Almost a Grand Slam
I had the opportunity this week to perform a quick review and test drive of a final production 2013 Accord EX-L Navi sedan with 4-cylinder engine and CVT. This was a full production model, not a pre-production version, so this was the real deal.
My initial impression was a little disappointing because I was expecting a more radical change in exterior styling. The changes are definitely more evolutionary than revolutionary, so there will be no mistaking this is an Accord. Styling is always subjective, and overall the 2013 Accord sedan is a handsome car from all angles, unlike the 2012 with its frumpy rear end. The apparent build quality, gaps between panels, etc. is exemplary both inside and out.
The interior is very comfortable with great sightlines to the instruments and a comfortable reach to the controls on the center stack. Even if you are not already a Honda fan, you will immediately feel at home in this car. Taller drivers and front seat passengers will appreciate the B-pillar cutouts that allow comfortable use of the door armrests even when the seats are all the way back. When those front seats are set back, there is still great legroom in the rear. For our test drive we had four adults in total comfort, but did not take the time to evaluate the center position in the rear.
After the initial oohs and aahs, I took a closer look and came up with the following major observations; there are other smaller details that I am not commenting on because they come down to a matter of personal preference and do not affect the functionality of the car.
Hits
The equipment level on the LX is better than an EX of old and includes Bluetooth, USB, rearview camera with guidelines, 16” alloys, dual-zone automatic A/C, projector beam headlights with auto on/off, CD, cruise, security system with remote, and more. You could stop right here and have a very satisfying car.
The Sport is unique in that it is the only model with 18” alloys and paddle shifters. It adds a dual exhaust and 4hp, but loses 1mpg in both city and highway ratings. The Sport also has a power driver’s seat and fog lights, but those two features are also included on everything EX and above. Without knowing the pricing, it’s hard to say whether the Sport is worthy of consideration. If I found the manual driver’s seat in the LX comfortable, I would probably just go with the LX and its higher mileage and forego the extra 4hp.
The EX looks like it will continue to be the sweet spot in the lineup with its usual addition of a moonroof, power driver's seat, fog lights, 17” alloys, two tweeters, and auto up/down front passenger window. More significant are the additions of rear A/C vents, heated side mirrors with turn signals, the long-awaited Smart Entry with Engine Start Button, and the new LaneWatch blind spot display. More info on Honda’s implementation of these new technologies can be found later in this review.
In addition to the usual leather heated seats, audio upgrades, and power passenger seat, the EX-L adds several more new technologies: Forward Collision Warning, Lane Departure Warning, HondaLink, and a multi-view to the rear camera. If you like leather interiors, you get the added bonus of these new toys.
If you get the V-6, you finally get a 6-speed automatic and a nice jump in highway fuel economy compared to last year’s model. The VCM has also been changed from 6-4-3 back to just 6-3 and supposedly no longer has the flat spot in the midrange, but I didn’t have a chance to personally validate that.
Adaptive Cruise Control and LED headlights are the only features that differentiate the Touring from the EX-L V-6 Navi. These are nice additions, but the Touring is only expected to account for 1% of the total sales.
Active noise cancellation is now in all models (even the LX), not just the V-6 with VCM.
You can finally turn the audio system on from the steering wheel, at least in the EX-L Navi; hopefully this feature is in the lower trim models, too. Alas, you still have to reach over to the dash to turn the audio system off.
The LaneWatch blind spot display is very slick. Instead of merely a light to indicate someone is in your blind spot, there is an actual dynamic camera view in the dash of what’s behind you in the lane to your right. The display, which includes guidelines for two car lengths, one car length, and metal-to-metal contact, is automatically activated when the right turn signal is selected; it can also be manually activated by pressing a button on the end of the turn signal lever, giving you the ability to take a look and see what’s there before deciding to signal your intention to change lanes. This system was very intuitive to use and is a welcome addition. Some will argue why is this only available for the right and not the left blind spot? There are at least two reasons. First, the left blind spot is already eliminated with the wide view outside mirror, similar to what was introduced on the CRV. Second and more important, it is natural to be looking to the right when changing lanes to the right, and therefore see the display to the right of the driver in the center of the dash. It would be unnatural and unsafe to be looking at a display to your right when changing lanes to the left. Overall, big kudos to Honda for their implementation of this technology, which will make the rush hour rat race safer and more enjoyable.
Misses
The horn is loud, but it’s a European pitch. I prefer a traditional American horn like in my Odyssey and older Accord.
There are no puddle lights on the bottom interior of the front doors, but the cutouts for them are in place. Honda apparently includes these lights in some overseas markets, but not in the US. What? My 2012 Odyssey, 2004 Accord, and just about every other Honda and competing manufacturer includes these lights, but not the flagship 2013 Accord? This simple omission gives the impression of being cheap.
Similarly, the rear seat is still not a split fold, and no longer has the ski pass through my older Accord has. Besides every competitor, doesn’t even the Civic have a split folding rear seat? Granted this might not be a feature I would use every day, but from time to time I have used the split fold in every one of my vehicles, including my truck. More than anything else, this omission could push someone to another brand if having this feature is essential to their use of the vehicle.
The Smart Entry with Engine Start Button comes across as a good copy of an older Toyota system, including the change from using the horn for confirmation of door locking to a Toyota-style chirp, but it falls short in several ways. First, the black button for locking on the exterior door handle detracts from the appearance of the car. Older Toyotas and Nissans had this, but Toyota switched to the much cleaner looking body-color ridges on the door handle several years ago; I’m not sure what Nissan uses now. Second, it is possible to lock one fob inside the car with no warning if the second fob is outside the car. If the fob inside happens to be in view, a thief can pop a door lock or reach through a window (that was left open or is simply broken by the thief), grab the fob and now steal the entire car. Toyota will not let you lock a fob inside the car under any circumstance, and emits an audible tone outside the car to warn you if you inadvertently try to. Third, you still have to take the fob out of your pocket and press and hold the unlock button to roll down the windows from outside the car, one of my favorite Honda features in sunny Arizona. The whole purpose of Smart Entry is to never have to take the fob out of your purse or pocket, yet I still have to do that if I want to externally roll down the windows. Here’s an easy fix: how about after placing your hand inside the exterior door handle, which is how you unlock the doors with the Smart Entry system, if you leave your hand there the windows start rolling down, similar to how holding the unlock button on the remote rolls the windows down now? This should be a simple software change that would give Honda’s system a feature that to my knowledge nobody else has. Finally, I didn’t notice any clues or instructions on the i-Mid display to help coach the uninitiated on how to use the system. As an example, in a Toyota if you press the start button without your foot on the brake, the screen lights up and tells you to step on the brake and press the button to start the car. Not a big deal for the experienced Start Button user, but a little in-car coaching would help avoid some frustration for newbies.
No auto-dimming mirror unless you get leather. Perhaps it can be added as a dealer accessory.
Similarly, no V-6 unless you get leather.
No HomeLink unless you get a V-6, which also implies leather. If I were king I would include HomeLink and the auto dimming mirror in the EX trim; if I am not mistaken this is a common aftermarket combo, but it’s still irritating being forced to buy extreme levels of equipment to get such common additions direct from the factory.
In the same way, Honda has reserved Forward Collision Warning, Lane Departure Warning, HondaLink, and a few other features that have nothing to do with the seat covering for the EX-L. If you’re a fan of leather, no big deal, but if you want the technology with a cloth interior you’re forced into another brand of car. An interesting anomaly is that HondaLink is included on the EX Coupe, but EX-L on the Sedan. I would include it on the EX Coupe and Sedan, period.
Some might argue that the LaneWatch blind spot display should be on all models if Honda is truly committed to safety. It’s a valid argument, but consider that this is also bundled with the heated side mirrors with turn signals since the camera is part of the outside mirror, so I can kind of understand why this feature is reserved for the EX and above.
Navi is required for HDD Audio. My 2012 Odyssey EX has HDD audio (one of our favorite features), so why not the Accord? Granted, as we move to external streaming and USB-driven devices the importance of HDD will eventually fade, but for now it’s frustrating that I can have this on my Odyssey but not the Accord.
The center console seems small compared to other Honda models and some competing brands. Other than the door pockets (which are great), there doesn’t seem to be much in the way of interior storage.
No glove box light. Thankfully, the overhead blue area light for nighttime remains.
The security system does not re-lock the doors during an attempted break-in. If a thief reaches through a broken or open window on a Toyota and tries to unlock a door, the Toyota will sound the alarm and instantly relock the doors; the Honda sounds the alarm but leaves the doors unlocked. A small distinction but it makes a big difference in saving your car. This should be a simple software change.
Some of the new technology like Pandora and HondaLink will eat up a lot of data on your cell phone, which is not an issue if you have an unlimited or very high data plan. This same limitation applies to competing brands that offer similar in-car entertainment systems.
Like all Hondas I am aware of, there is a dashboard indication when the parking lights are on without the headlights, and that indication does not change when the headlights are turned on. In contrast, Toyota has no dashboard indication when the parking lights are on, but does give an indication when the headlights are added. The Toyota system is more logical, and if adapted by Honda might help reduce the number of Honda drivers I see every night mistakenly driving without their headlights on. Yes, a driver should be smart enough to know when to use the headlights on his own, but if you’re going to have a dashboard indication of when your lights are on, make that indication for the headlights, not the parking lights.
Fell a little short of the Altima for highest EPA fuel economy. We’ll find out in a couple days when the news embargo is lifted how the real world fuel economy compares.
Driving Impressions
We went on a brief drive with four adults in the car and found the overall feel, noise level, acceleration, ride, and CVT performance to be very good. It felt like a Honda – a good Honda – and that’s a good thing. Our limited time behind the wheel did not lend itself to any instrumented testing, extreme handling maneuvers, or back-to-back comparison with competing midsize cars, so that will have to wait for a more extensive test drive later. We did include a 3-mile loop using ECO in light traffic at 35-50mph where the car’s computer showed 41.4mpg average, but that was way too short of a test in near optimum conditions to draw any sustaining mileage conclusions.
Should You Buy One?
If you’re a die-hard Honda fan who doesn’t think any other brand is worth considering, and there are a lot of folks on vtec that fit in this category, then I can unequivocally recommend the 2013 Accord. There is a lot of content improvement over the 2012 Accord that will more than make up for the modest price increase Honda will likely announce.
If you’re a big Honda fan who also recognizes there are other great brands out there, the 2013 Accord should definitely be on your short list. Honda has finally caught up with the competition in the area of basic electronics, and has added new technology such as the LaneWatch blind spot display that is industry leading. How many customers bought other brands for many years because of Honda’s insistence on bundling simple things like Bluetooth in the most expensive trim lines? Now those same customers will be looking to Honda as a leader in this category, although they still might have to pony up for a higher trim level for some of those goodies.
If you’re a skeptic or perhaps a former Honda fan who has moved on to other brands, you owe it to yourself to check out this newest Accord. Even in the last model year of the last generation, the 2012 Accord still made the Car and Driver 10 Best List for a record 26th time, and this 2013 model is significantly better. Some of the most critical considerations when car shopping are durability, quality, and reliability. The quality will be evident when you check out the Accord, and there is plenty of information already out there that attests to Honda’s record on durability and reliability.
Not Quite the Grand Slam
It was close, but Honda still fell a little short of making the perfect car with the 2013 Accord. Honda got a black eye with the Civic (and to their credit is pushing through improvements to the Civic in record time), so you would think they would have gone all out with the Accord, and they almost did. Go through the list of misses listed above and you will see that most are minor but in the aggregate can be quite annoying. Long time Honda owners have come to expect certain features, and when those features are taken away, we get upset. Similarly, when you know another manufacturer does certain things just a little bit better, it makes you wonder why Honda doesn’t step up and incorporate these improvements when they have had ample opportunity.
I will need to spend more time studying the lower trim models of the 2013 Accord and doing some back-to-back comparisons with the competition, but based on this initial review it is safe to say the 2013 Accord will be another home run for Honda. Hopefully they will keep striving for improvement and someday soon finally hit that grand slam.
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VTEC_Inside
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Too bad about the models.
I find it very frustrating that you can't get a 'loaded' 4cyl car, but must go to the V6 to get every last goodie.
An EX-L Navi 4cyl SHOULD be identical feature wise to its 6 cyl brother other than powertrain of course.
If Honda had done that with the previous gen then my grandpa would own a 4cyl 2010 model, not the V6. Homelink in particular is a tough one to lose.
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superchg2
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Super Review!
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talon95
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The blue ambient light over the console doesn't "remain", it was added back. Honda dropped it from the gen 8 MMC. I'm glad to hear that, because I liked that feature.
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Gfn8r
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The puddle lights, pass-through and glovebox light are prime examples of bean-counters going to extremes. From what I can see in the specs, it looks like Honda removed the functionality on NAVI models that uses the GPS to help the climate-control compensate for sun angle. (They've had that since the 7th-Gen.) The puddle-lights have been around since the 4th-Gens, at least.
So you're saying that, unlike the 8th-Gen MMC where they left the dimple in the overhead console, the LED ambient light is back?! Jeezus! H! Christ!!! Did they have a bean-counter drop dead, and they pried it out of his cold, dead hands?!
There is a HomeLink solution available from College Hills Honda in Wooster, OH, but since Honda stopped pre-wiring cars for options (with the 7th-Gen, likely, where the HomeLink was available as a plug-and-play accessory for EXs), their solution is to solder a lithium battery from a normal garage-door opener to the power supply. Of course, when the battery dies, you have to take the overhead console apart to replace it! :-|
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DCR
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Thanks for the review. I thought it was level and honest...and these days I wonder how the spread of features will affect product selection.
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BorisHonda
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Great honest review! If puddle lights have wiring it is easy to retrofit. I replaced mine dim yellow lights with LED from some GE garden lights. Same goes for trunk light. 12V, nice white color. Door lights helps when you open door after parking on the street not so you can see but to be SEEN by others.
It will be nice to open another Tread and compile ALL of complains; then we all send them to Honda USA or Honda Canada. Eventually they would listen.
I know Honda Canada responds to letters since they did for every one I sent them for Civic '96 and Accord '04. Eventually they listen and from Accord '04 to the end of production of 7th gen they DID make some changes I was lounging for. Not that they listened to me, but maybe some other folks have same complains.
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talon95
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talon95 wrote:
The blue ambient light over the console doesn't "remain", it was added back. Honda dropped it from the gen 8 MMC. I'm glad to hear that, because I liked that feature.
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It just occurred to me that my statement might not reflect an apples to apples comparison. Daniel, did you drive a US-spec Accord? As we all know, features can and do vary between US and Canadian spec units.
I could never figure out why Honda figures that Canadian drivers need to know when their washer fluid is low, but American drivers aren't interested. There's lots of snow where I live in the US and it's not uncommon to use so much washer fluid during thaws that you run out unexpectedly. I try to compensate by checking the level more often, but the warning light would sure be more convenient.
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superchg2
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BorisHonda wrote:
It will be nice to open another Tread and compile ALL of complains; then we all send them to Honda USA or Honda Canada. Eventually they would listen.
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Boris, it sounds like they were listening with the new Accord.
And really, I think that most of us here do not get on TOV just to complain.
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talon95
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Oh, I almost forgot... thanks for the great review! Very thorough and tells it like it is...
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TonyEX
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Accord Coupe V6 MT6
Accord Sedan Sport I4 MT6
IMHO, AHM was listening.
True, I wish you could get NAVI in the Sport Sedan.... but I got a feeling that lots of kids will pop for the Sport Sedan and add an aftermarket stereo.
While nuts like me will happily just step right up pop for the V6 MT6.. again. ;-D
Puddle lights? Low windshield washer fluid warning? Homelink? I don't think I've ever knew those things existed or used them...
And, that lane change warning unless you use the turn signal... I sure hope I can turn that thing OFF.
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Gfn8r
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Gfn8r wrote:
The puddle lights, pass-through and glovebox light are prime examples of bean-counters going to extremes. From what I can see in the specs, it looks like Honda removed the functionality on NAVI models that uses the GPS to help the climate-control compensate for sun angle. (They've had that since the 7th-Gen.) The puddle-lights have been around since the 4th-Gens, at least.
So you're saying that, unlike the 8th-Gen MMC where they left the dimple in the overhead console, the LED ambient light is back?! Jeezus! H! Christ!!! Did they have a bean-counter drop dead, and they pried it out of his cold, dead hands?!
There is a HomeLink solution available from College Hills Honda in Wooster, OH, but since Honda stopped pre-wiring cars for options (with the 7th-Gen, likely, where the HomeLink was available as a plug-and-play accessory for EXs), their solution is to solder a lithium battery from a normal garage-door opener to the power supply. Of course, when the battery dies, you have to take the overhead console apart to replace it! :-|
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I just submitted an E-Mail to College Hills asking if they might rig a solution for the glovebox light, if they have any knowledge of why Honda left out the door lights (if they'll bring them out in other markets, say), and if there is even a prayer of having paddle-shifters retrofitted to V6 Sedans. (You've gotta think all the programming is in place for it, but since Honda is too cheap to include a light in the glovebox and doesn't pre-wire for a HomeLink...! :-| ) I'm curious about the paddles because the V6 Sedans will end up like Fords, with no way to manually-select gears; in the winter around town--35mph or less, I start off in second-gear if the snow is deep--it helps de-stress the driving a little, and the engine-braking is a huge help.
@TonyE--there is a button to defeat LDW on the left side of the dash, next to the VSA button. Hopefully, it "remembers" your setting between restarts.
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MasterOfDaDomain
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Thanks for the nice review.
It does seem like a very solid car, so it's really more like a double with a couple of RBIs.
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Gfn8r
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talon95 wrote:
talon95 wrote:
The blue ambient light over the console doesn't "remain", it was added back. Honda dropped it from the gen 8 MMC. I'm glad to hear that, because I liked that feature.
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It just occurred to me that my statement might not reflect an apples to apples comparison. Daniel, did you drive a US-spec Accord? As we all know, features can and do vary between US and Canadian spec units.
I could never figure out why Honda figures that Canadian drivers need to know when their washer fluid is low, but American drivers aren't interested. There's lots of snow where I live in the US and it's not uncommon to use so much washer fluid during thaws that you run out unexpectedly. I try to compensate by checking the level more often, but the warning light would sure be more convenient.
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That would be nice to have. I'm guessing that the low-fluid warning is a Canadian-government-mandated item.
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DanielAcosta
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Thanks to all for your comments.
The car I evaluated was US spec, and I did not check to see if it had a warning light for low windshield washer fluid.
All of my vehicles have Homelink and an auto dimming mirror EXCEPT my 12 Odyssey EX, which has Homelink but only a manual mirror. Several years ago it seemed like an EX in any Honda model would be similarly equipped, but that is certainly not the case anymore.
Tony, thanks for warning all of us that you don't use turn signals when you change lanes. :-) Maybe in a few years Honda will add a feature that activates the turn signals for you when it knows you are intentionally changing lanes and not just drifting out of your lane.
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owequitit
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Gfn8r wrote:
The puddle lights, pass-through and glovebox light are prime examples of bean-counters going to extremes. From what I can see in the specs, it looks like Honda removed the functionality on NAVI models that uses the GPS to help the climate-control compensate for sun angle. (They've had that since the 7th-Gen.) The puddle-lights have been around since the 4th-Gens, at least.
So you're saying that, unlike the 8th-Gen MMC where they left the dimple in the overhead console, the LED ambient light is back?! Jeezus! H! Christ!!! Did they have a bean-counter drop dead, and they pried it out of his cold, dead hands?!
There is a HomeLink solution available from College Hills Honda in Wooster, OH, but since Honda stopped pre-wiring cars for options (with the 7th-Gen, likely, where the HomeLink was available as a plug-and-play accessory for EXs), their solution is to solder a lithium battery from a normal garage-door opener to the power supply. Of course, when the battery dies, you have to take the overhead console apart to replace it! :-|
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Our 1988 LX has puddle lights...
I am glad to see that the put the LED back in the overhead console though. I remember what a nice feature that was in the 7th gen for subtly illuminating the cup holder region so you could see what you were doing.
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owequitit
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I am also curious why they wouldn't put the full feature set in a set of 4 cylinder cars, especially given the divergence of some wanting the features and better fuel economy, versus those that also want the performance and extra power. It seems like it would be a no brainer, and I am sure a fully loaded 4 cylinder would sell really well.
Also, I wish our Accord Sport sat more in line with the Canadian car in terms of available features, but at least they put a 6MT.
The other thing I though was a little disappointing, but pretty trivial was the inclusion of the stellar 18" wheel package on the Sport and Coupe, but not on the V6 sedans.
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talon95
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TonyE wrote:
Puddle lights? Low windshield washer fluid warning? Homelink? I don't think I've ever knew those things existed or used them...
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I wouldn't have thought of low windshield washer fluid warning either, except that I'm on my 4th Accord Owner's manual that lists the feature with the footnote "Canadian models only". They even have the non-functional warning light built into the instrument panel. 3 generations running, and I assume gen 9 will be the 4th. Mentioned as an aside regarding differences in equipment in different areas, not as a complaint like "life as I know it will end if I don't get this feature!". I'd like it, but life goes on.
Homelink is kind of overkill if you have only your one garage door remote, though it's a minor nicety to not have the remote hanging on your visor. I'll appreciate it more if I ever move into a gated community (doubtful) that adds another remote.
Puddle lights? I knew they existed but never gave them a thought beyond that.
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talon95
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owequitit wrote:
I am glad to see that the put the LED back in the overhead console though. I remember what a nice feature that was in the 7th gen for subtly illuminating the cup holder region so you could see what you were doing.
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Yeah, I glad to hear that, too. They had a blue version in the pre-MMC gen 8 (I liked the amber in gen 7 better), but I was surprised to find that my 2011 didn't have it. Along with the tray and mat in the center armrest, the glove compartment light, the underhood light, the full cover on the V6 engine and the spring on the fuel filler door. The latter is a PITA on a windy day, since the door keeps blowing partially shut, which sometimes knocks the cap off of the bracket on the door. Anyway, I was really happy to get the USB audio connector, the memory seats and the vents for the rear seat passengers, but the loss of those little details dulled the new car excitement a bit. Lesson learned... even if you're getting just an updated version of your current car, confirm if any features were removed that might kill the deal. None of these were for me anyway, but still...
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TonyEX
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owequitit wrote:
...
I am glad to see that the put the LED back in the overhead console though. I remember what a nice feature that was in the 7th gen for subtly illuminating the cup holder region so you could see what you were doing.
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Yes... that was one thing that really bothered me about the '11 CRV. I mean, we got the absolute top of the line twice in a row.. '09 and '11... EX-L AWD NAVI... but the '11 dropped that little light which was useless 98% of the time but tremendously useful 2%.
How much did AHM save on that? Peanuts.
Like, for example, the missing trunk liner and the missing wheel well liners in our '12 Si. I mean, these are minor details but Honda has always been about details...
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Gfn8r
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Yes, details! Yes, it's all small stuff, but they'd sweat it anyway!
Not any more! :-(
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owequitit
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talon95 wrote:
owequitit wrote:
I am glad to see that the put the LED back in the overhead console though. I remember what a nice feature that was in the 7th gen for subtly illuminating the cup holder region so you could see what you were doing.
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Yeah, I glad to hear that, too. They had a blue version in the pre-MMC gen 8 (I liked the amber in gen 7 better), but I was surprised to find that my 2011 didn't have it. Along with the tray and mat in the center armrest, the glove compartment light, the underhood light, the full cover on the V6 engine and the spring on the fuel filler door. The latter is a PITA on a windy day, since the door keeps blowing partially shut, which sometimes knocks the cap off of the bracket on the door. Anyway, I was really happy to get the USB audio connector, the memory seats and the vents for the rear seat passengers, but the loss of those little details dulled the new car excitement a bit. Lesson learned... even if you're getting just an updated version of your current car, confirm if any features were removed that might kill the deal. None of these were for me anyway, but still...
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Yeah our 09 still has it. I did also like the amber better. It gave a nice faint glow that managed to light up the console area better than the blue one does, without being any brighter. My 09 Si still has the red one, but that is almost useless except under certain lighting conditions (I think the dimmer has to be way up).
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owequitit
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TonyE wrote:
owequitit wrote:
...
I am glad to see that the put the LED back in the overhead console though. I remember what a nice feature that was in the 7th gen for subtly illuminating the cup holder region so you could see what you were doing.
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Yes... that was one thing that really bothered me about the '11 CRV. I mean, we got the absolute top of the line twice in a row.. '09 and '11... EX-L AWD NAVI... but the '11 dropped that little light which was useless 98% of the time but tremendously useful 2%.
How much did AHM save on that? Peanuts.
Like, for example, the missing trunk liner and the missing wheel well liners in our '12 Si. I mean, these are minor details but Honda has always been about details...
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I agree. It is hard to feel like you AREN'T being nickel and dimed to death by that stuff. One thing I still like about the 8th gen Si, is that they had a trunk liner in until the MMC for '09, so at least I had the option to order a retrofit kit from College Hills Honda (although it was ~$100 that Honda should have saved me by including it and putting it on the sticker). I bought it finally because it will make the trunk look more finished and it will protect the underside of the trunk lid and hinge arms from paint damage...
I know that a lot of their older cars didn't have it (my 90 EX does not, and I think the 6th gen was the first to include it), but that is the price of progress. You can't add something and then take it away and expect people not to care...
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benbess
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owequitit wrote:
TonyE wrote:
owequitit wrote:
...
I am glad to see that the put the LED back in the overhead console though. I remember what a nice feature that was in the 7th gen for subtly illuminating the cup holder region so you could see what you were doing.
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Yes... that was one thing that really bothered me about the '11 CRV. I mean, we got the absolute top of the line twice in a row.. '09 and '11... EX-L AWD NAVI... but the '11 dropped that little light which was useless 98% of the time but tremendously useful 2%.
How much did AHM save on that? Peanuts.
Like, for example, the missing trunk liner and the missing wheel well liners in our '12 Si. I mean, these are minor details but Honda has always been about details...
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I agree. It is hard to feel like you AREN'T being nickel and dimed to death by that stuff. One thing I still like about the 8th gen Si, is that they had a trunk liner in until the MMC for '09, so at least I had the option to order a retrofit kit from College Hills Honda (although it was ~$100 that Honda should have saved me by including it and putting it on the sticker). I bought it finally because it will make the trunk look more finished and it will protect the underside of the trunk lid and hinge arms from paint damage...
I know that a lot of their older cars didn't have it (my 90 EX does not, and I think the 6th gen was the first to include it), but that is the price of progress. You can't add something and then take it away and expect people not to care...
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Honda is in business to make very good cars, but also make a profit while doing it.
When you add it up, it's almost jaw dropping the number of things that have been added to Accords in the last 10-15 years.
My 2002 Accord LX had drum brakes, no abs, 15" wheels with plastic covers, a nice enough but rather spartan and simple dash.
It did have DWB suspension, though, which was excellent.
But look what an Accord LX has for 2013. I don't have to name it for you. It's almost too much. And even with economies of scale Honda has to pay a certain amount in cold hard dollars for each and every feature. And yet when you take inflation into account, list prices have barely moved since 2002.
Something's gotta give.
My 02 had front and rear puddle lights. My 08 has only front puddle lights. And my 13 won't have any puddle lights, but it will have more than a dozen other features, most of which I care more for a lot more than puddle lights.
I actually think the Honda accountants and bean counters lost big time on this 2013 Accord. Honda got so beat up over the 12 Civic that the orders from the top brass were essentially, "Win this at any cost!"
And so they added what seems like c. $2000+ worth of stuff to the 13 Accord LX compared to the previous year, but they cut out maybe $100 for from puddle lights. Seems like we came out the winners here—at least in most ways.
I'm still holding my breath when it comes to the suspension and electric steering. But I'm overall feeling even optimistic about those things. I've driven my brother-in-law's 2012 Civic Si, and the steering and suspension both seemed good to me. Would they be better with DWB and hydraulic? Probably a little. But it was still a very sharp driving car. I know some people are upset with the 12 Si because you can't rev past 7000 rpm now, but I rarely go past 5k rpm anyway....
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FiSH-Chan
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Question, what are puddle lights, and where are they located?
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superchg2
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benbess wrote:
I actually think the Honda accountants and bean counters lost big time on this 2013 Accord. Honda got so beat up over the 12 Civic that the orders from the top brass were essentially, "Win this at any cost!"
And so they added what seems like c. $2000+ worth of stuff to the 13 Accord LX compared to the previous year, but they cut out maybe $100 for from puddle lights. Seems like we came out the winners here—at least in most ways.
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Exactly!
I noticed that alloy wheels are standard on all Accords for '13.
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owequitit
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benbess wrote:
owequitit wrote:
TonyE wrote:
owequitit wrote:
...
I am glad to see that the put the LED back in the overhead console though. I remember what a nice feature that was in the 7th gen for subtly illuminating the cup holder region so you could see what you were doing.
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Yes... that was one thing that really bothered me about the '11 CRV. I mean, we got the absolute top of the line twice in a row.. '09 and '11... EX-L AWD NAVI... but the '11 dropped that little light which was useless 98% of the time but tremendously useful 2%.
How much did AHM save on that? Peanuts.
Like, for example, the missing trunk liner and the missing wheel well liners in our '12 Si. I mean, these are minor details but Honda has always been about details...
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I agree. It is hard to feel like you AREN'T being nickel and dimed to death by that stuff. One thing I still like about the 8th gen Si, is that they had a trunk liner in until the MMC for '09, so at least I had the option to order a retrofit kit from College Hills Honda (although it was ~$100 that Honda should have saved me by including it and putting it on the sticker). I bought it finally because it will make the trunk look more finished and it will protect the underside of the trunk lid and hinge arms from paint damage...
I know that a lot of their older cars didn't have it (my 90 EX does not, and I think the 6th gen was the first to include it), but that is the price of progress. You can't add something and then take it away and expect people not to care...
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Honda is in business to make very good cars, but also make a profit while doing it.
When you add it up, it's almost jaw dropping the number of things that have been added to Accords in the last 10-15 years.
My 2002 Accord LX had drum brakes, no abs, 15" wheels with plastic covers, a nice enough but rather spartan and simple dash.
It did have DWB suspension, though, which was excellent.
But look what an Accord LX has for 2013. I don't have to name it for you. It's almost too much. And even with economies of scale Honda has to pay a certain amount in cold hard dollars for each and every feature. And yet when you take inflation into account, list prices have barely moved since 2002.
Something's gotta give.
My 02 had front and rear puddle lights. My 08 has only front puddle lights. And my 13 won't have any puddle lights, but it will have more than a dozen other features, most of which I care more for a lot more than puddle lights.
I actually think the Honda accountants and bean counters lost big time on this 2013 Accord. Honda got so beat up over the 12 Civic that the orders from the top brass were essentially, "Win this at any cost!"
And so they added what seems like c. $2000+ worth of stuff to the 13 Accord LX compared to the previous year, but they cut out maybe $100 for from puddle lights. Seems like we came out the winners here—at least in most ways.
I'm still holding my breath when it comes to the suspension and electric steering. But I'm overall feeling even optimistic about those things. I've driven my brother-in-law's 2012 Civic Si, and the steering and suspension both seemed good to me. Would they be better with DWB and hydraulic? Probably a little. But it was still a very sharp driving car. I know some people are upset with the 12 Si because you can't rev past 7000 rpm now, but I rarely go past 5k rpm anyway....
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I've owned em since the late 80's and am pretty familiar with what they offered (still own the oldest two). To the best of my recollection, Honda has always made money selling Accords , and yet I felt like I was actually getting a product ABOVE my price class, and not being nickel and dimed to death in the past.
There is a difference between adding a nominal sum to the MSRP to maintain the status quo and chintzing the car to keep the price the same, which is the strategy Honda took up starting with the 6th gen Accord (which coincidentally is where cost cutting started to become apparent). Now, that is not to say that I want a $50K dollar Accord, but there is a level of balance in between the two extremes. Most of the fanboys on here assert ridiculous things like "Honda has to make money" (you are NOT one of them for the record), when in reality, some of the stuff most of us are talking about would nominally add no more than a couple hundred bucks to the MSRP all inclusive. Hell, paying somewhere between wholesale and retail, I can add a trunk liner for $100. Honda's cost is probably well less than half of that. The LED in the overhead would save what, like $3? If Honda continues to erode perceived quality, then people are going to erode the amount they are willing to pay in kind.
I again point to Apple, who has proven that people are willing to pay relatively more for a product that they PERCEIVE is worth it. Same goes for every luxury car on the face of the planet (which coincidentally also carry higher profit margins). Honda used to make good business and very loyal customers (as well as gained a lot of market share) by making a car that went that extra little bit to make the buyer feel like the extra $500-1,000 was worth it.
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benbess
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Yeah, interesting comparison to Apple.
Some of the best Honda designs in my mind are akin to the elegance and superior engineering of Apple.
Even the 1973 Civc that came out when I was about 7 had a certain purity to it. But to me the first really almost Apple-like design was the radical looking 1984 Civic. And when they went to double wishbones on the sleek 1986 Accord, it was clear that here was a company bringing superior and elegant engineering and design to the masses—and building them right in the usa.
I think this 2013 Accord actually gets back to that elegant kind of design quite a bit. It's a lot better looking than my 2008 Accord imho! But there are some serious trade offs, like loss of DWB and the shift to electric steering.
But look at what we've gained. The Earth Dreams name may be silly or even annoying, but most of us want to save money at the pump while still enjoying good performance. And pretty much whatever anyone's politics, if you live in the usa you probably feel ok about keeping money here at home rather than sending it to certain countries in the middle east.
Looked at in a good light, most of these changes will help us do that. This test drive seems to show that the new Accord has a fast and sporty fun to drive factor, impressive safety, and yet significantly higher mpg, largely through superior Honda engineering.
The demand for gadgets has arguably gotten out of hand, and Honda has embraced it. It's a mixed bag. But I must admit I have embraced auto gadgets too. As recently as a dozen years ago, I used to fantasize about a car with manual roll down windows and no power anything—not even steering (I grew up with manual steering cars, bc my parents drove VWs). But now I'm thinking of getting about every gadget known to car-kind with a new EXL navi.
I don't know if they solved it completely, but I bet they have dozens and dozens of smart and hard working Honda engineers working on making a direct injected engine that doesn't have build up—or at least not much.
Well, enough ramblings. I am looking forward to the reviews tomorrow. Hope you'll keep and open mind and maybe even do a test drive owequitit.
I agree that some Honda designs in the last 5 years have been a let down (crosstour, etc, yikes), but this car looks to me like it'll be a winner in form and function.
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FiSH-Chan
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FiSH-Chan wrote:
Question, what are puddle lights, and where are they located?
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OK so since no one answer I search myself and found this.
Your Accords really had these???
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benbess
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FiSH-Chan wrote:
FiSH-Chan wrote:
Question, what are puddle lights, and where are they located?
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OK so since no one answer I search myself and found this.
Your Accords really had these???
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YEAH baby~! That's what I'm talkin about! Those are like Austin Powers-style puddle lights. lol.
But I actually kinda like em....
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