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TOV Forums > Professional Motorsports > > Re: Honda qualifies 1-2-3-4 at Texas

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Honda Dream
Profile for Honda Dream
Honda qualifies 1-2-3-4 at Texas    (Score: 1, Normal) 06-09-2012 03:39
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http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/100206

.....with 0,5 mph advantage over the best Chevy-powered car. Looks like Honda is truly better at the moment. Still Honda-Chevy 2:4 in race wins also in pole positions I believe. I don't expect Lotus to mix among the two in that catagory but who knows????
sadlerau
Profile for sadlerau
Re: Honda qualifies 1-2-3-4 at Texas    (Score: 1, Normal) 06-09-2012 04:05
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Lotus are well out of it - they may not even be allowed to finish this race, but due to their low speeds may be asked to literally park the Lotus engined cars after a few laps - as they did at Indianapolis.

Can't see Penske and Chevy taking their situation lying down. How long before they ask for an up-grade??
mobis21
Profile for mobis21
Re: Honda qualifies 1-2-3-4 at Texas    (Score: 1, Normal) 06-09-2012 09:10
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Looks like the update to the shroud is really working for the Honda motor.

Sadlerau, I agree, Iilmor Engineering is going petition for MORE.
DrWhiner
Profile for DrWhiner
Re: Honda qualifies 1-2-3-4 at Texas    (Score: 1, Normal) 06-09-2012 09:53
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sadlerau wrote:
Lotus are well out of it - they may not even be allowed to finish this race, but due to their low speeds may be asked to literally park the Lotus engined cars after a few laps - as they did at Indianapolis.

Can't see Penske and Chevy taking their situation lying down. How long before they ask for an up-grade??


'Unscheduled' engine change will result in penalty. No?
Bullwinkle
Profile for Bullwinkle
Re: Honda qualifies 1-2-3-4 at Texas    (Score: 1, Normal) 06-09-2012 18:44
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mobis21 wrote:
Looks like the update to the shroud is really working for the Honda motor.

Sadlerau, I agree, Iilmor Engineering is going petition for MORE.



The "upgrade" in performance of Honda is mostly due to LEGAL changes that were made with the new engines on Carb day at Indy.

For some reason that I do NOT understand, everyone seems to think that the engines are FROZEN for the season. That is just not so.

There is a list of parts that had to be Homologated in March. Those parts cannot be changed. ANYTHING ELSE CAN be updated and improved. So Ilmor can change any of those "open" items any time they want to. They would only have to petition Indycar if they wanted to change one of the parts that was homologated.

If the engine manufacturers live within the engine life regulations (about 1800 miles per engine), then each team should go through five engines this season. Each new engine should be better than the last, so one would assume that Honda and Chevy would have five successive development Steps.

the Honda engine that was introduced at Indy was "step 2".

Please read these two excellent articles on the subject:

http://gordonkirby.com/categories/columns/theway/2012/the_way_it_is_no337.html

http://gordonkirby.com/categories/columns/theway/2012/the_way_it_is_no338.html






DrWhiner
Profile for DrWhiner
Re: Honda qualifies 1-2-3-4 at Texas    (Score: 1, Normal) 06-10-2012 20:06
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Thanks. Interesting read.
[1] "You've got five engines in a season so each one of those five can have a different piston stack, for example. So you're going to concentrate on refining the details of the pistons to get a better combustion process and be more efficient. I think the fuel efficiency of this latest engine is a step up from what we had before and certainly a step up on power as well. We've laid out the plan for the year and each one of those five engines will be a step up based on what we can do within IndyCar's homologation specifications." ...

[2] "The other thing is that GM and Ilmor elected to change all their engines at Long Beach and take a penalty. We have not done that. We followed IndyCar's direction which says you run the first engine up to its mileage limit and then you change to the next engine. That's the way the process is supposed to work.

"Having done that, the first time you have the opportunity to put improved hardware into the engine is after the first change when you've used up your engine life. So we did that and the new stuff was put into the cars prior to Carburetion Day and I think you can see the results.

"Ilmor chose to put their engines in early. Therefore, they had the chance to step-up in performance at that opportunity. But there's no free lunch. If you put an engine in early then you've got penalties on the back end." ...

[3] Direct injection with ethanol...

"In some ways it's been good for our younger guys. You hate to say it, but it's good for them to experience a loss because they know what that feels like. When you've been winning so long you forget what losing's like.

"I think you have to acknowledge that Ilmor has done an extremely good job with the Chevy program," Rahal said. "There's a tremendous amount of Indy car experience at Ilmor and I think frankly that was their advantage in the short term. Most if not all the people at Ilmor have years of experience with different Indy car engines, particularly turbocharged engines.
 
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