|
|
|
|
 |
CarPhreakD
 |
|
HONDA AFVM wrote:
"In the past, Honda designers didn't need permission to veer off script. They often banded together to work in secret on an alternative version of a car when unhappy with the approved blueprint. Going "behind the screen," as it was called, often had the tacit backing of managers who felt it upheld the spirit of Soichiro Honda."
Remember those "insiders" I always talk about......The above is what I was talking about, the guys and gals that took it to the next level, pushed the envelope..............What is left of them and their spirit is pushing from with in and these 2 guys they are talking about sound like the innovators of these "insiders"
|
AFVM, I have the impression that the NSX2 is actually from this type of thinking.
|
Nick GravesX
|
|
longhorn wrote:
Finally an article that could have been written by a long time TOVer. We knew something something was not quite right. Its like they had their foot on accelerator through the 80s and 90s, and then when 2000s came they took their foot off and started coasting. Good to have SOMEONE in Honda have a little attittude.
"What we need to do is to raise the quality of the output by such a high margin that it will shut everybody up," said Asahi.
If this website would let me, that would be my avatar.
|
Word.
|
A77
|
|
it doesn't matter which (non Si) civic you drive the ride is not choppy. CR are just plain wrong. I guarantee you every single person who drove the 11 and the 12 commented that the 12 had a better ride - better bump absorption, less noise, more comfort. Its also a fact that the ride does not deteriorate unduly when loaded up, unlike the 11. The criticisms concern the interior design and choice of textures and colors. Sure nobody is in love with the sedan's appearance (the coupe is generally preferred to its predecessor).
The Si is a bit choppy, but less than its predecessor. It's meant this way. Paradoxically, CR recommended the Si.
|
HONDA AFVM
|
|
CarPhreakD wrote:
HONDA AFVM wrote:
"In the past, Honda designers didn't need permission to veer off script. They often banded together to work in secret on an alternative version of a car when unhappy with the approved blueprint. Going "behind the screen," as it was called, often had the tacit backing of managers who felt it upheld the spirit of Soichiro Honda."
Remember those "insiders" I always talk about......The above is what I was talking about, the guys and gals that took it to the next level, pushed the envelope..............What is left of them and their spirit is pushing from with in and these 2 guys they are talking about sound like the innovators of these "insiders"
|
AFVM, I have the impression that the NSX2 is actually from this type of thinking.
|
Oh, I have no doubt that the NSX was FORCED upon the "establishment" and was thought up on an OFF GRID computer and a back room warehouse with a lock that only 5 people had a key.............when done, they slapped it in the face of the Top Brass and said, Either put this in front of the world, or WE will........... and say it is the next NSX and YOU will have to deal with the Media and explain to THEM why the car was made then canceled AGAIN.........
This is ALL SPECULATION on my part, 100%.....but the more I talk to people I know and sources and long time Honda people, these people are "NOT happy with "BEANS" they want to GROW something with those beans, not COUNT THEM"..............
Notice the quoits..............but who told me that???
|
TonyEX
|
|
Torque wrote:
...
I am born and raised in NJ and I can definitely vouch for the food part. Short of going to those countries, you will find some of the best Mom & Pop ethnic eateries. Domino's, Papa John's, etc. never opened up locations near where I grew up because of all the authentic Italian restaurants. If you want some of the best paella, go to Jersey City. The Jewish Delis and bagel shops are the real deal. Little India in Iselin has some of the best Northern/Southern Indian food you can find. Whenever I go back to visit I always make sure to stop by some of the old favorites.
|
Well.. paella wise I beg to differ... I make a KILLER PAELLA and so do my mom and aunt. In the West Coast.
Also, you can get good paella at La Espaņola in Harbor City CA (just north of Long Beach).
And Indian food is very good and strong in the West Coast as well.
Pretty much, I think the West Coast has the lock on Pacific Rim cuisine: Chinese, Japanese, Vietnamese, Indian, Polynesian etc... we even have some reasonably good Cuban... folks that sort of took a left turn onto the I10 instead of keeping heading up north on the I95.
And we got In'N'Out which pretty much seals the Burger World Cup towards SoCal.
Jewish, oddly is strong too in the Westside (Westwood) and The Valley because of the rich New Yorkers that moved here.. it is however gentrified and not gritty (re: real)....
But mostly, Italian, Spaniard, Portuguese.. we got NOTHING. It sucks to walk into a "Spanish" restaurant and find that it's owned by Argentinians.
BTW- I AVOID "The Olive Garden"...
But, since this is TOV after all... there are excellent Japanese restaurants in Torrance.. all around AHM (and yes... TMS as well). ;-)
|
superchg2
|
|
TonyE wrote:
Torque wrote:
...
I am born and raised in NJ and I can definitely vouch for the food part. Short of going to those countries, you will find some of the best Mom & Pop ethnic eateries. Domino's, Papa John's, etc. never opened up locations near where I grew up because of all the authentic Italian restaurants. If you want some of the best paella, go to Jersey City. The Jewish Delis and bagel shops are the real deal. Little India in Iselin has some of the best Northern/Southern Indian food you can find. Whenever I go back to visit I always make sure to stop by some of the old favorites.
|
Well.. paella wise I beg to differ... I make a KILLER PAELLA and so do my mom and aunt. In the West Coast.
Also, you can get good paella at La Espaņola in Harbor City CA (just north of Long Beach).
And Indian food is very good and strong in the West Coast as well.
Pretty much, I think the West Coast has the lock on Pacific Rim cuisine: Chinese, Japanese, Vietnamese, Indian, Polynesian etc... we even have some reasonably good Cuban... folks that sort of took a left turn onto the I10 instead of keeping heading up north on the I95.
And we got In'N'Out which pretty much seals the Burger World Cup towards SoCal.
Jewish, oddly is strong too in the Westside (Westwood) and The Valley because of the rich New Yorkers that moved here.. it is however gentrified and not gritty (re: real)....
But mostly, Italian, Spaniard, Portuguese.. we got NOTHING. It sucks to walk into a "Spanish" restaurant and find that it's owned by Argentinians.
BTW- I AVOID "The Olive Garden"...
But, since this is TOV after all... there are excellent Japanese restaurants in Torrance.. all around AHM (and yes... TMS as well). ;-)
|
If you want some really good BBQ, come to KC! If you like barbeque ribs, brisket, sausage, chicken we've got more super BBQ joints than you can shake a fork at.
Mexican cuisine is super in KC, as well. We even have a 24 hour place called Pancho's down the street where you can get a killer breakfast chorizo burrito at 4 in the morning! Yum!
|
CarbonGray Earl
|
|
Who the heck brings up California cuisine and then brings up California Pizza Kitchen.
Cali's got THE best Asian food, and a very rich food culture. Indeed, both NorCal and SoCal boast the greatest concentrations of many populations outside their home country.
There is great Vietnamese here, many varieties and genres of Chinese food, different genres of Japanese food, Filipino food, even an Ethiopian district, indian districts (North/south) or even Pakistani variants of Indian food. Add to that, these are pretty normal places....great food, but everyday stuff here.
Our Mexican food culture is great (not sure how the other border states stack up). However, from my Mexican friends themselves, there is none better than the Mexican food in San Diego....I personally think its the fact that you're eating that authentic baja fish taco in the best weather in the country, but I digress.
Distinct from Mexican food, we have a good number of central and south american restaurants that have some great food.
One last thing...except for the Ethiopian food, the other things are all within a 5 mile radius of my house.
Sure we have 'fusion', but it completely mischaracterizes SoCal food to equate CPK with what we all experience here.
|
TonyEX
|
|
superchg2 wrote:
TonyE wrote:
Torque wrote:
...
I am born and raised in NJ and I can definitely vouch for the food part. Short of going to those countries, you will find some of the best Mom & Pop ethnic eateries. Domino's, Papa John's, etc. never opened up locations near where I grew up because of all the authentic Italian restaurants. If you want some of the best paella, go to Jersey City. The Jewish Delis and bagel shops are the real deal. Little India in Iselin has some of the best Northern/Southern Indian food you can find. Whenever I go back to visit I always make sure to stop by some of the old favorites.
|
Well.. paella wise I beg to differ... I make a KILLER PAELLA and so do my mom and aunt. In the West Coast.
Also, you can get good paella at La Espaņola in Harbor City CA (just north of Long Beach).
And Indian food is very good and strong in the West Coast as well.
Pretty much, I think the West Coast has the lock on Pacific Rim cuisine: Chinese, Japanese, Vietnamese, Indian, Polynesian etc... we even have some reasonably good Cuban... folks that sort of took a left turn onto the I10 instead of keeping heading up north on the I95.
And we got In'N'Out which pretty much seals the Burger World Cup towards SoCal.
Jewish, oddly is strong too in the Westside (Westwood) and The Valley because of the rich New Yorkers that moved here.. it is however gentrified and not gritty (re: real)....
But mostly, Italian, Spaniard, Portuguese.. we got NOTHING. It sucks to walk into a "Spanish" restaurant and find that it's owned by Argentinians.
BTW- I AVOID "The Olive Garden"...
But, since this is TOV after all... there are excellent Japanese restaurants in Torrance.. all around AHM (and yes... TMS as well). ;-)
|
If you want some really good BBQ, come to KC! If you like barbeque ribs, brisket, sausage, chicken we've got more super BBQ joints than you can shake a fork at.
Mexican cuisine is super in KC, as well. We even have a 24 hour place called Pancho's down the street where you can get a killer breakfast chorizo burrito at 4 in the morning! Yum!
|
Actually, we have excellent BBQ in California. It's the dry rub style cooked over oak coals...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santa_Maria_Style_BBQ
Mexican? LOL.. we're actually past that. As you might now, Los Angeles is currently owned by people from south of the border.. hence we don't have mexican anymore... but Oaxacan, Jalisco, etc... cuisine from regions of Mexico... not "mexican".
Same with Chinese and Japanese and Korean and Indian, etc... a long time ago it become all about regional cuisines.
|
TonyEX
|
|
CarbonGray Earl wrote:
Who the heck brings up California cuisine and then brings up California Pizza Kitchen.
Cali's got THE best Asian food, and a very rich food culture. Indeed, both NorCal and SoCal boast the greatest concentrations of many populations outside their home country.
There is great Vietnamese here, many varieties and genres of Chinese food, different genres of Japanese food, Filipino food, even an Ethiopian district, indian districts (North/south) or even Pakistani variants of Indian food. Add to that, these are pretty normal places....great food, but everyday stuff here.
Our Mexican food culture is great (not sure how the other border states stack up). However, from my Mexican friends themselves, there is none better than the Mexican food in San Diego....I personally think its the fact that you're eating that authentic baja fish taco in the best weather in the country, but I digress.
Distinct from Mexican food, we have a good number of central and south american restaurants that have some great food.
One last thing...except for the Ethiopian food, the other things are all within a 5 mile radius of my house.
Sure we have 'fusion', but it completely mischaracterizes SoCal food to equate CPK with what we all experience here.
|
I brought up CPK... it's California fusion at its best. Try their BBQ chicken pizzas.... the one with indian flavors.
Then you got the Korean Taco Trucks... I mean that's outstanding.. we make those at home with Korean Ribs, Cilantro, Corn tortillas and Siracha sauce... that's SoCal Fusion at its best.
In fact, the only Spanish Restaurant I know of in SoCal is a Fusion restaurant up in West LA that I can't afford.
As far as ethnic, you're quite right. San Diego too is outstanding for Mexican foods. They even got a Roberto's next to a Marukai food court in Kearny Mesa... outstanding weather too. ;-)
But SD is south of La Migra's checkpoints on the 5 and 15. >:-P
PS- I dare say that TexMex must be very good too.. but then it's native Texan by now since "mexicans" have lived in Texas since the 1500s.
|
CarPhreakD
|
|
|
California does not have the best asian food. It's pitiful compared to Vancouver and Toronto.
|
Jesse
|
|
The last posts make me hungry.
Going back to the main topic. The disease that Honda is suffering is pretty common: it's PRIDE. It's what started their decline. Pride: they thought they could get away with anything including mediocrity because of their name; they believed that they're above and beyond the competition; and they placed money first over their core principles. If Soichiro was alive today, I am pretty sure many of the so-called "Top Brass" in the company would be fired or struck by his wrath.
And lastly: Bean Counters. It's all about the money ei? I despise them.
|
FiSH-Chan
|
|
Jesse wrote:
It's all about the money ei? I despise them. |
It's always about the money... it's where it goes that matter more
Well it's a good direction with all this we can expect very different things after this esp. with the ED engines and the NSX2 and whatever else that follows.
|
CarbonGray Earl
|
|
I highly doubt that 2 cities in Canada have the diversity and variety that California has.
Anyways, just a difference of opinion....enough thread hijack, carry on....
|
hondadude
|
|
|
This Reuters article is spreading all over. If you search honda news on your brower this article appears on many different websites. It was posted late Friday night on Automotive News and Friday afternoon on msnbc.com and the Chicago Tribune.
|
TonyEX
|
|
CarPhreakD wrote:
California does not have the best asian food. It's pitiful compared to Vancouver and Toronto.
|
Canada's Chinese food is all about Hong Kong.
LA's Chinese food is all from all regions.
|
CarPhreakD
|
|
CarbonGray Earl wrote:
I highly doubt that 2 cities in Canada have the diversity and variety that California has.
Anyways, just a difference of opinion....enough thread hijack, carry on....
|
I don't expect you to understand, the problem is that you don't realize just how many Chinese, Japanese and Koreans are here. White folks are the minority. You're hard pressed to find variety of food from different parts of China (including HK, Taiwan and Macau), or even good Japanese and Korean foods elsewhere.
|
CarbonGray Earl
|
|
And I don't expect you to know me. And yes I do realize the diversity of Toronto or Vancouver. 30% Chinese for Vancouver, no? The problem is, you are starting to make assumptions about me as you 'don't expect me to understand'.
My own city is 52% Asian, whites 33% and we're one of the less Asian areas for my region. I'm Asian as well (if that matters). So I do understand diversity and my Asian food.
its fine that you are making assumptions without knowing me or my perspective, but you compared ALL of california (a population of 35+ million) to a couple of districts in Toronto and Vancouver. That, in and of itself, is preposterous.
BTW...I never said anything about Toronto or Vancouver, only that it hardly has the diversity or variety California has. By virtue of sheer size and recently immigrated population, how could this not be true? Why is this so offensive a concept to you?
|
bigblue
|
|
Hey ! No fighting about asian sub-regional cuisine in the North Americas on Tov ! You're meant to be fighting about cup holder cover plastic quality, and whether it should be (1) hard, simple, durable classic Honda 90's stuff, (2) elegant slightly squishy quality Honda '00s stuff or (3) hard, simple, durable, de-contented cheap Honda '10s stuff ;-)
Being semi-serious, not living in NA I have no idea what the interior of a new Civic is like, but it seems to have kicked up one hell of a stink. Is it worse than the old 80s/90's stuff, which as far as I remember wasn't very soft touch ? My car is old, has plastics that would no doubt make a new Civic look like is was hewn from granite, has no cupholders at all (the horror !), but it's a fun drive.
|
Varmint
|
|
Couple things...
Blaming "the bean counters" is standard operating procedure. They can't blame the designers. That would erode consumer confidence and the brand's reputation for engineering. Management can't blame themselves. That would look bad to investors and the Wall Street types. Bean counters are anonymous. The bean counters just provide recommendations about the financial parameters for a project. Management then decides whether to accept that advice.
I thought Frank Paluch was the LPL for both generations of the MDX. Does that policy about not allowing the same designer lead the same project twice only apply at Honda and not Acura?
Also, I like having a couple of product gurus with the power to veto boring designs from the pipeline. It's a good thing for a company to have people in charge of excitement. But where are the guys dedicated to products that are already in production? Fixing things that are in design means very little change for the next few years. Honda already has products that are interesting and compelling on some level, but are failing because of some tragic flaw... typically, too little engine. Fix those flaws and they could have meaningful change within a year.
|
CarPhreakD
|
|
CarbonGray Earl wrote:
And I don't expect you to know me. And yes I do realize the diversity of Toronto or Vancouver. 30% Chinese for Vancouver, no? The problem is, you are starting to make assumptions about me as you 'don't expect me to understand'.
My own city is 52% Asian, whites 33% and we're one of the less Asian areas for my region. I'm Asian as well (if that matters). So I do understand diversity and my Asian food.
its fine that you are making assumptions without knowing me or my perspective, but you compared ALL of california (a population of 35+ million) to a couple of districts in Toronto and Vancouver. That, in and of itself, is preposterous.
BTW...I never said anything about Toronto or Vancouver, only that it hardly has the diversity or variety California has. By virtue of sheer size and recently immigrated population, how could this not be true? Why is this so offensive a concept to you?
|
Actually, you seem to be the one offended, considering I've only mentioned that the asian food in California is pretty subpar.
I mean, you don't need to take it from me. I'm Chinese myself and I have relatives in both Vancouver and California (and being a Toronto native), but if you feel that California has the world's greatest Chinese food, by all means.
Like Blue said, I will continue bitching about cupholders.
|
CarPhreakD
|
|
Varmint wrote:
Couple things...
Blaming "the bean counters" is standard operating procedure. They can't blame the designers. That would erode consumer confidence and the brand's reputation for engineering. Management can't blame themselves. That would look bad to investors and the Wall Street types. Bean counters are anonymous. The bean counters just provide recommendations about the financial parameters for a project. Management then decides whether to accept that advice.
I thought Frank Paluch was the LPL for both generations of the MDX. Does that policy about not allowing the same designer lead the same project twice only apply at Honda and not Acura?
Also, I like having a couple of product gurus with the power to veto boring designs from the pipeline. It's a good thing for a company to have people in charge of excitement. But where are the guys dedicated to products that are already in production? Fixing things that are in design means very little change for the next few years. Honda already has products that are interesting and compelling on some level, but are failing because of some tragic flaw... typically, too little engine. Fix those flaws and they could have meaningful change within a year.
|
Varmint, what I'm getting from the article isn't that "designers" can't work on the same vehicle twice, but the engineering project chief leading development on a vehicle.
At least from what I'm seeing right now where I work, there is a general cultural attitude in the design and parts release phase that can either tilt towards quality (a well known and reputable, but not necessarily inexpensive supplier), technology (the tryout of new technologies such as electric water pumps and thermostats in place of regular mechanical units), and obviously the lowest common denominator (the cheapest possible supplier). Sometimes, it's not up to the choice of the design and release engineers, but from a company's purchasing department and systems cost engineers who ultimately questions the engineer's need for a particular component. Sometimes, especially in large companies, the recommendations from purchasing is "law". In other words, oftentimes the engineers and engineering managers have their hands tied by what they can and cannot do as dictated by purchasing.
Things that can be blamed on engineers and managers is usually structural- a flat organization is usually more advantageous because with several thousand parts on modern vehicles, it can be hard to keep track of the various changes involved if the management structure grows too large and top heavy. In the case of the big 3, things became so hard to track and fragmented that what you start finding is that the department for a particular vehicle would start to develop their own engine, without realizing that another department in the same organization is doing the same. The end result is you get two random engines needlessly, which costs money, quality, and further tightens resources that could be used for other things in vehicles. It takes strong leadership to prevent needless complexity and strong project focus, especially in huge corporations.
|
CarbonGray Earl
|
|
CarPhreakD wrote:
CarbonGray Earl wrote:
And I don't expect you to know me. And yes I do realize the diversity of Toronto or Vancouver. 30% Chinese for Vancouver, no? The problem is, you are starting to make assumptions about me as you 'don't expect me to understand'.
My own city is 52% Asian, whites 33% and we're one of the less Asian areas for my region. I'm Asian as well (if that matters). So I do understand diversity and my Asian food.
its fine that you are making assumptions without knowing me or my perspective, but you compared ALL of california (a population of 35+ million) to a couple of districts in Toronto and Vancouver. That, in and of itself, is preposterous.
BTW...I never said anything about Toronto or Vancouver, only that it hardly has the diversity or variety California has. By virtue of sheer size and recently immigrated population, how could this not be true? Why is this so offensive a concept to you?
|
Actually, you seem to be the one offended, considering I've only mentioned that the asian food in California is pretty subpar.
I mean, you don't need to take it from me. I'm Chinese myself and I have relatives in both Vancouver and California (and being a Toronto native), but if you feel that California has the world's greatest Chinese food, by all means.
Like Blue said, I will continue bitching about cupholders.
|
And I have relatives in Vancouver and Toronto. I haven't called Toronto or Vancouver 'pitiful', in fact I'd gladly get Asian food there (or many types of other cuisine for that matter).
I don't expect you to know me or how diverse my food tastes are because of where i live.
Anyways, let's leave it at that....like I said, merely a difference of opinion, carry on with the thread.
|
DCR
|
|
CarbonGray Earl wrote:
Anyways, let's leave it at that....like I said, merely a difference of opinion, carry on with the thread.
|
Yes, thanks...
Anyway, all of this is still simply talk. Blaming the accountants is one part, but as I have said before, someone gave these projects and designs the green light.
Who is responsible for executive decisions?
Looks at these two quotes, back to back in the article.
"We should have been more aggressive," said Honda's top engineer, Yoshiharu Yamamoto. "The Civic is a cornerstone. And to have that car get the feedback that it did, we have to take that to heart."
John Mendel, Honda's U.S. sales chief, has argued fallout from Consumer Reports' poor review has been minimal, pointing to the Civic's segment-leading sales in recent months. For the first two months of 2012, Civic's U.S. sales were up 45 percent.
I am surprised the engineers are being this vocal, for one. They are essentially calling management right out in public, and that is usually not a good idea. Second, Mendel and Co. have been able to paint a picture of good Civic sales by using the old Detroit method of tossing money on the hood. What is next? Fleet sales?
Just because these guys work for Honda doesn't instantly make them Honda guys...either you get the culture or you do not. We are seeing the results of those who do not get it.
|
superchg2
|
|
DCR wrote:
Second, Mendel and Co. have been able to paint a picture of good Civic sales by using the old Detroit method of tossing money on the hood. What is next? Fleet sales?
|
Good point DCR.
"But industry research firm TrueCar.com says incentives on the Civic have more than quintupled since its debut last April to almost $1,900 per car in January, suggesting sales are being driven by attractive deals."
|
HONDA AFVM
|
|
CarbonGray Earl wrote:
Who the heck brings up California cuisine and then brings up California Pizza Kitchen.
Cali's got THE best Asian food, and a very rich food culture. Indeed, both NorCal and SoCal boast the greatest concentrations of many populations outside their home country.
There is great Vietnamese here, many varieties and genres of Chinese food, different genres of Japanese food, Filipino food, even an Ethiopian district, indian districts (North/south) or even Pakistani variants of Indian food. Add to that, these are pretty normal places....great food, but everyday stuff here.
Our Mexican food culture is great (not sure how the other border states stack up). However, from my Mexican friends themselves, there is none better than the Mexican food in San Diego....I personally think its the fact that you're eating that authentic baja fish taco in the best weather in the country, but I digress.
Distinct from Mexican food, we have a good number of central and south american restaurants that have some great food.
One last thing...except for the Ethiopian food, the other things are all within a 5 mile radius of my house.
Sure we have 'fusion', but it completely mischaracterizes SoCal food to equate CPK with what we all experience here.
|
Orrroahhhyahh, OK, I am done yawning now, NY/NJ has had all that for a century..........Everyone makes Mexican food........LOL!!! Now I did eat at a GREAT Ethiopian joint in LA tho, have to say I was impressed.............I am planning a trip out to LA with in the next 6 months if the $$$ allows, so I will post it on here and we can all meet and go to dinner..........
|
Colin
|
|
superchg2 wrote:
DCR wrote:
Second, Mendel and Co. have been able to paint a picture of good Civic sales by using the old Detroit method of tossing money on the hood. What is next? Fleet sales?
|
Good point DCR.
"But industry research firm TrueCar.com says incentives on the Civic have more than quintupled since its debut last April to almost $1,900 per car in January, suggesting sales are being driven by attractive deals."
|
True, but since you don't incentivize cars that you don't have (earthquake, tsunami, flooding) it makes sense that there is more on the Civic now that they have production up. My question is: how does this number compare historically to Civics in general? I'm guessing it's on the high side, but aren't there normally some incentives on the car?
Also, as noted, Honda has been running a Flex Cash incentive in which the amount is variable depending on the dealers discretion. BUT (and this is a big BUT), the number of certificates a dealer has is determined by the previous months' sales.
So for example, in January we had 20 certificates worth $250 each, they let us use up to 4 per transaction but once they were gone, they were gone till the next month. So in that month, somebody might have gotten $1000 and another person later in the month $0. How did Reuters/Truth calculate this in their figure?
Finally, to complicate matters, Certificates were earned ONLY on specific models' sales' and in Jan we had only 6-7 MDXs to sell and we sold them all, but our sales of RDX didn't count for certificates. This meant that in February we only had a handful of certificates to use. Complicated? Yes. Irritating? YES! But I can say that this 'system' makes it pretty hard to say which cars(s) had $XXX on the hood.
I think its important that the forum understand how this program is working before jumping to conclusions.
|
HONDA AFVM
|
|
CarbonGray Earl wrote:
CarPhreakD wrote:
CarbonGray Earl wrote:
And I don't expect you to know me. And yes I do realize the diversity of Toronto or Vancouver. 30% Chinese for Vancouver, no? The problem is, you are starting to make assumptions about me as you 'don't expect me to understand'.
My own city is 52% Asian, whites 33% and we're one of the less Asian areas for my region. I'm Asian as well (if that matters). So I do understand diversity and my Asian food.
its fine that you are making assumptions without knowing me or my perspective, but you compared ALL of california (a population of 35+ million) to a couple of districts in Toronto and Vancouver. That, in and of itself, is preposterous.
BTW...I never said anything about Toronto or Vancouver, only that it hardly has the diversity or variety California has. By virtue of sheer size and recently immigrated population, how could this not be true? Why is this so offensive a concept to you?
|
Actually, you seem to be the one offended, considering I've only mentioned that the asian food in California is pretty subpar.
I mean, you don't need to take it from me. I'm Chinese myself and I have relatives in both Vancouver and California (and being a Toronto native), but if you feel that California has the world's greatest Chinese food, by all means.
Like Blue said, I will continue bitching about cupholders.
|
And I have relatives in Vancouver and Toronto. I haven't called Toronto or Vancouver 'pitiful', in fact I'd gladly get Asian food there (or many types of other cuisine for that matter).
I don't expect you to know me or how diverse my food tastes are because of where i live.
Anyways, let's leave it at that....like I said, merely a difference of opinion, carry on with the thread.
|
HEY, HEY!!!! DAMN!!!! BOTH YOU ASS CLOWNS are STEALING MY THUNDER...........I am the only one who is supposed to be the out spoken, offensive, racist, NON PC, Tea Party Republican, War Loving, Foreign people Hating nut job on this sight...........LOL, Just kidding..........OMG, all this over FOOD?? I have never been to Vancouver, but I have been to LA and most major cities in America........I have been to Toronto tho and the Asian food there was OUT STANDING!!!! So if the East Coast version of Canada is any hint of how good the West Coast of Canada is, then to each it's own, and AS A CERTIFIED CHEF MY SELF, CULINARY SCHOOL EDUCATED and a Degree to prove it, FOOD is ALL in the taster, and what YOU think is the best, I may think just SUCKS..........
I learned MANY years ago as a Chef that many people will come into the kitchen and tell you how great your food is, it's the people who leave and say nothing that you have to worry about. That is why I meet EACH AND EVERY customer that came into my restaurant.........so to be SURE they were happy and is they had a problem, I could FIX it the next time.......
It's JUST FOOD BOYS..........Think about the RAP us Italians get..........
I left the FOOD business 17 years ago, it was just too boring for me........I like cars/Hondas and people, not kitchens......Although I still love to cook for people.....
|
Hondu
|
|
HONDA AFVM wrote:
CarbonGray Earl wrote:
Who the heck brings up California cuisine and then brings up California Pizza Kitchen.
Cali's got THE best Asian food, and a very rich food culture. Indeed, both NorCal and SoCal boast the greatest concentrations of many populations outside their home country.
There is great Vietnamese here, many varieties and genres of Chinese food, different genres of Japanese food, Filipino food, even an Ethiopian district, indian districts (North/south) or even Pakistani variants of Indian food. Add to that, these are pretty normal places....great food, but everyday stuff here.
Our Mexican food culture is great (not sure how the other border states stack up). However, from my Mexican friends themselves, there is none better than the Mexican food in San Diego....I personally think its the fact that you're eating that authentic baja fish taco in the best weather in the country, but I digress.
Distinct from Mexican food, we have a good number of central and south american restaurants that have some great food.
One last thing...except for the Ethiopian food, the other things are all within a 5 mile radius of my house.
Sure we have 'fusion', but it completely mischaracterizes SoCal food to equate CPK with what we all experience here.
|
Orrroahhhyahh, OK, I am done yawning now, NY/NJ has had all that for a century..........Everyone makes Mexican food........LOL!!! Now I did eat at a GREAT Ethiopian joint in LA tho, have to say I was impressed.............I am planning a trip out to LA with in the next 6 months if the $$$ allows, so I will post it on here and we can all meet and go to dinner..........
|
Ethiopian food? I didn't know they had any...
|
DCR
|
|
Hondu wrote:
Ethiopian food? I didn't know they had any...
|
Hey...that's my job.
|
TonyEX
|
|
bigblue wrote:
Hey ! No fighting about asian sub-regional cuisine in the North Americas on Tov ! You're meant to be fighting about cup holder cover plastic quality, and whether it should be (1) hard, simple, durable classic Honda 90's stuff, (2) elegant slightly squishy quality Honda '00s stuff or (3) hard, simple, durable, de-contented cheap Honda '10s stuff ;-)
Being semi-serious, not living in NA I have no idea what the interior of a new Civic is like, but it seems to have kicked up one hell of a stink. Is it worse than the old 80s/90's stuff, which as far as I remember wasn't very soft touch ? My car is old, has plastics that would no doubt make a new Civic look like is was hewn from granite, has no cupholders at all (the horror !), but it's a fun drive.
|
The problem with the new Civic and CRV is that they don't have enough cupholders to hold a take out chinese meal... I mean, a proper chinese meal takes at least six dishes plus rice, huh?
And where do you put the TsingTao and the tea?
Me thinks that AHM thinks that the only worthy "asian" food for their cars is an obento box meal or a plate lunch for L&L BBQ (*), which you can put in your lap and park the Sapporo and Green Tea in the cup holders.
And since the cupholders are small, you're stuck with the small Sapporo which is proper since we'll be eating this meal WHILE PARKED somewhere... so when we driver afterwards we won't be too happy....
(*) Yeah, take that you haoles... Hard to get L&L in most of the country... ;-P
|
|
|
| |
|
| Thread Page - 1 [2] 3 4 |
| |
|
![[home]](http://sohc.vtec.net/elem04/home.gif){kind=small}
![[rumors and news]](http://sohc.vtec.net/elem04/rumors.gif){kind=small}
![[model release matrix]](http://sohc.vtec.net/elem04/newmodelreleasematrix.gif){kind=small}
![[dealer network]](http://sohc.vtec.net/elem04/dealernet.gif){kind=small}
![[desktop calendar]](http://sohc.vtec.net/elem04/calendar.gif){kind=small}
![[exhaust notes]](http://sohc.vtec.net/elem04/exhaust.gif){kind=small}
![[tov forums]](http://sohc.vtec.net/elem04/forums.gif){kind=small}
![[links]](http://sohc.vtec.net/elem04/links.gif){kind=small}
![[search]](http://sohc.vtec.net/elem04/search.gif){kind=small}
![[sponsors]](http://sohc.vtec.net/elem04/sponsors.gif){kind=small}
![[garage]](http://sohc.vtec.net/elem04/garage.gif){kind=small}
![[login]](http://sohc.vtec.net/elem04/login.gif){kind=small}
