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iLyVTEC-J30A4
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I hope I dont sound like an idiot, however... It seams that Honda had quickly forgotten about its First J series engine. The 2.5L DIRECT INJECTED VTEC V6, it was only used in the inspire (Japanese TL/Accord V6) for about 5 years until discontinued. Output was 200 hp @ 6200 RPM and 177 lb·ft of torque @ 4600 RPM.
But my theory Is, those numbers ^^^ where produced in 1996 with a very basic and not so modern DI system, and SOHC and what was basically the original VTEC system.
In 2013, With basically every aspect of the engine re vitalized, (die-cast aluminum block with cast-iron cylinder sleeves, MUCH improved DI, i-VTEC, VCM, new intake and exhaust systems, much more advanced ECU's, Friction reduction, improved pistons, more aggressive cams, And possibly even, *I Wish* DOHC...
I see this motor easily making 245 HP and 240 trq. Paired to the 6AT.
With the CR-V weighing about 3400 LBS (The same as a gen 7 Accord with the J30A5). Even considering the CR-V is higher and wider... I see all of the following being possible.
Let me know if im a bit too optimistic. :D
0-60: 7 seconds
1/4M: 16 Seconds @ about 85 +/-
Towing Capacity: 2500-3000 LBS (remember its a 6AT, not as tall as the 5AT)
^Does any of this make sense? Im just trying to go with the small V6 approach, gas mileage could be the same as the K24 if the J25 had the above enhancements and a 6AT.
Would the J30 or J32 be better than the J25? Would the J35 be overkill like the RAV 4 V6? (My grandma can barely go pays 1/4 throttle in hers. Haha :P)
Honda seriously needs to do something, because the K24 aint going to be able to compete with the EcoBoost or the 2GR-FE in the RAV4 by any means. And I am almost certain that the next SantaFe and tucson will have a Turbo option.... Thoughts?
- Myles Wong
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superchg
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iLyVTEC-J30A4 wrote:
^Does any of this make sense? Im just trying to go with the small V6 approach, gas mileage could be the same as the K24 if the J25 had the above enhancements and a 6AT.
Honda seriously needs to do something, because the K24 aint going to be able to compete with the EcoBoost or the 2GR-FE in the RAV4 by any means. And I am almost certain that the next SantaFe and tucson will have a Turbo option.... Thoughts?
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Agreed, Honda needed to do something. The reality is that Honda didn't bring out the rumored I4 K25 and the automatic is still a 5 speed.
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Mechanic
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Quoting "Hondarulez":
"C/D did a road test (not first drive review) with actual test numbers:
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2012-honda-cr-v-road-test-review
C/D TEST RESULTS (numbers in brackets are from old CR-V):
Zero to 60 mph: 8.5 sec (8.7s)
Zero to 100 mph: 24.7 sec (26.1s)
Street start, 5–60 mph: 9.3 sec (9.4s)
Top gear, 30–50 mph: 4.8 sec (5.2s)
Top gear, 50–70 mph: 5.9 sec (6.2s)
Standing ¼-mile: 16.6 sec @ 85 mph (16.7@84mph)
Top speed (governor limited): 118 mph (117mph)
I guess the bottom line is, the new one is slightly faster than the previous model while being more efficient. If you are fine with the old model in terms of performance, the new one should be fine as well, unless you are hoping for a big jump in power."
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99SI
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What is even more interesting is that we have already seen spec sheets with the K25. I just don't understand.
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danielgr
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99SI wrote:
What is even more interesting is that we have already seen spec sheets with the K25. I just don't understand.
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That was not a "spec sheet".
As for the tranny... I don't know, but I also remember pretty well that long ago dealers got the whole colour codes and it was pretty clear it was only 5AT. Why people got to believe those may have changed is beyond me. Comparing reliability of Automotive-News made charts with Dealers ordering info isn't very straight forward...
PS: For the OP, imho it would make sense if there was no RDX. Since there is an RDX, I don't think it'd make sense. It's like having economy and business on a plane..., you won't add an economy+ class unless you are sure it won't hurt the business one.
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Varmint
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The J25 had the same exterior dimensions as the newer J series engines. Which is to say: it's too big for the engine compartment. Plus, no other product is using it.
Rather than looking to 1996, I expect Honda has something on the drawing board for 2014ish. That's where your answer lies.
As for the "can't compete" argument... well... I find myself writing this post every five years. Here's the short version.
Everyone declared the B20 CR-V dead when Subaru released the more powerful 2.4L Forester in 1998. It was dead again when Suzuki released the 2.5L V6 in the Grand Vitara. Ford released the 3.0L Escape shortly after Nissan's V6-powered Xterra. Honda answered those with a K24 in the 2002 CR-V and sent them all back to fleet sales. Doesn't matter though because Toyota got serious and dropped a huge honkin' V6 into the RAV4. That should crush the CR-V, right? Honda answered with the same K24 and a nice interior. Once again, the CR-Z stole the lion's share of sales. Toyota went back to the drawing board scratching their heads.
The question is not, "When is Honda going to add more power?"
The question is, "When are we keyboard jockeys going to learn that power is not a significant factor?"
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Powered by Honda
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Maybe a V6 that is lighter and smaller then the decade old J.
But not the J.
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Double J
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danielgr wrote:
99SI wrote:
What is even more interesting is that we have already seen spec sheets with the K25. I just don't understand.
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That was not a "spec sheet".
As for the tranny... I don't know, but I also remember pretty well that long ago dealers got the whole colour codes and it was pretty clear it was only 5AT. Why people got to believe those may have changed is beyond me. Comparing reliability of Automotive-News made charts with Dealers ordering info isn't very straight forward...
PS: For the OP, imho it would make sense if there was no RDX. Since there is an RDX, I don't think it'd make sense. It's like having economy and business on a plane..., you won't add an economy+ class unless you are sure it won't hurt the business one.
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It could be that Honda does not want to release a new engine in the CR-V yet: 1. They want to save the tech for new Accord release then trickle down/around or 2. They want to differentiate the Acura line with higher tech drivetrains?
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Fan Koni
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Double J wrote:
danielgr wrote:
99SI wrote:
What is even more interesting is that we have already seen spec sheets with the K25. I just don't understand.
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That was not a "spec sheet".
As for the tranny... I don't know, but I also remember pretty well that long ago dealers got the whole colour codes and it was pretty clear it was only 5AT. Why people got to believe those may have changed is beyond me. Comparing reliability of Automotive-News made charts with Dealers ordering info isn't very straight forward...
PS: For the OP, imho it would make sense if there was no RDX. Since there is an RDX, I don't think it'd make sense. It's like having economy and business on a plane..., you won't add an economy+ class unless you are sure it won't hurt the business one.
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It could be that Honda does not want to release a new engine in the CR-V yet: 1. They want to save the tech for new Accord release then trickle down/around or 2. They want to differentiate the Acura line with higher tech drivetrains?
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Hey Honda R&D had a few issues to fight.
I am sure they are working overtime on new engines.
The new Euro Civic is behind, the new CRV will be introduced to EU/JP in over half a year, the sub TSX needs something...
I dont think this is just an Acura vs Honda issue - they have always shared K&J Engines.
I really expect Honda to introduce the new engines very soon.
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dootndo2
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Varmint wrote:
The J25 had the same exterior dimensions as the newer J series engines. Which is to say: it's too big for the engine compartment. Plus, no other product is using it.
Rather than looking to 1996, I expect Honda has something on the drawing board for 2014ish. That's where your answer lies.
As for the "can't compete" argument... well... I find myself writing this post every five years. Here's the short version.
Everyone declared the B20 CR-V dead when Subaru released the more powerful 2.4L Forester in 1998. It was dead again when Suzuki released the 2.5L V6 in the Grand Vitara. Ford released the 3.0L Escape shortly after Nissan's V6-powered Xterra. Honda answered those with a K24 in the 2002 CR-V and sent them all back to fleet sales. Doesn't matter though because Toyota got serious and dropped a huge honkin' V6 into the RAV4. That should crush the CR-V, right? Honda answered with the same K24 and a nice interior. Once again, the CR-Z stole the lion's share of sales. Toyota went back to the drawing board scratching their heads.
The question is not, "When is Honda going to add more power?"
The question is, "When are we keyboard jockeys going to learn that power is not a significant factor?"
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It's funny, because every time someone makes the argument "The 2.4 sold well!" I find myself frustrated. Some of us (meaning me at least) would like to buy a 5 passenger SUV with a V6. I loved my 02 CRV EX AWD.
I own boat that weighs 2900 lbs on the trailer and would like to own a Honda product that I can use to tow my boat the 2 or 3 times per year that I need to. But, I don't have kids and an 8 passenger Pilot that gets 18-19 MPG is not suitable for me. The MDX is awesome, but again, too high priced and it runs on premium.
There are some of us that would like the OPTION. Instead, we are not given options to configure the vehicle to best suit our needs and wants. I would also like a 6MT to go with the V6. There is no reason that Honda couldn't do this leveraging parts that are already in the bin.
I would LOVE a diesel option with 6MT and 3000 lbs towing. That would fit the bill nicely.
Again, as mentioned, the CRV sells very well to it's defined target market. A V6 option would only add to those numbers. To be clear, if it could be accomplished with a 4 cylinder, I would be fine with that. Or, if I could by a $2000 towing package for the current CRV that included better brakes, larger coolant fans, etc, that would also work for me.
Not offering any of these options sucks. Until they do, I'll continue to wait.
dootndo2
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